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Posted by roqayya (Member # 16255) on :
 
I am in the U.S., wanting to marry an Egyptian muslim man. I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men? How often do they shower? Do they smell odd also (again compared with american men). Sorry for the odd question, thanks.
 
Posted by LovedOne (Member # 10222) on :
 
You *are* joking right....
 
Posted by roqayya (Member # 16255) on :
 
nope no joke
 
Posted by Dubai Girl (Member # 15488) on :
 
Hygiene is a personal thing. It's got nothing to do with where you're from or what religion you practise. If you're so curious ask your bloke how often he goes in the bath and next time you're with him have a good hard sniff in his direction and then you can decide if he smells odd and if he does buy him some aftershave/deodorant/new socks (tick as appropriate)

What a random question!!!!!!!! I think some people could be offended by it as it sounds racist beyond belief, although I'm sure this isn't your intention, at least I hope not!
 
Posted by LovedOne (Member # 10222) on :
 
I get the feeling she hasn't met him yet, so she can't exactly give him a sniff.
However, when you are interested in knowing something about someone, I find that it is best to ask them, instead of asking other people about them. The person you want to know about will invariably know more than some stranger. And as was pointed out, hygiene is a personal thing. Different for everyone to some degree.

If he went onto a public board and asked about American women's bathing habits, what would you think? Would you rather he asked you?
 
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
I am in the U.S., wanting to marry an Egyptian muslim man. I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men? How often do they shower? Do they smell odd also (again compared with american men). Sorry for the odd question, thanks.
From this we pick up that you havent met him yet in person? Please think very hard what you're doing and dont assume because hes Muslim that he will be marrying you and treating you right for the right reasons.

All the Egyptian men I know keep themselves very clean, mine certainly does, and smells gorgeous all the time!

Read some stories here before you rush off to marry someone you dont know PLEASE! [Roll Eyes]
 
Posted by Dubai Girl (Member # 15488) on :
 
Well said Aisha I totally agree with you

I'm marrying an Egyptian and he smells lovely too, in fact he has the best grooming habits out of any man I've ever known. A total Metrosexual He also owns more shoes than any man I've ever known but that's a different story.... :-)
 
Posted by India (Member # 16104) on :
 
Total random and bizarre question....

Anways, the Egyptian guy that I know has amazing hygiene and takes incredible care of himself. I have never known any other guy to be as clean and groomed! I totally agree with Dubaigirl's metrosexual comment [Smile]
 
Posted by Sashyra8 (Member # 14488) on :
 
I think we all agree she must have not met him in person yet.If this is like this,many more and even more important questions should arise before considering giving that very serious step.
 
Posted by ExptinCAI (Member # 1439) on :
 
Culturally stereotyping, Americans are known to overbathe and be a bit fanatical about their daily or morning AND evening showers, even when they're not actually needed.

Maybe you need to explain to your new partner how in your culture, there's a tendency to over do it and hint you may find it odd, etc. rather than ask about his hygiene.
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
It's not an odd question at all. You can't blame the girl for wanting to understand something about a culture she is obviously not familiar with. Of course, it is best to just ask him directly, but she obviously has a reason she has not done this yet. That being said, here is my take on the situation.

Islam is a religion that in general principle advocates cleanliness. However, bear in mind, that personal hygiene habits are developed as a direct result of other mitigating factors. Upbringing, personal choice and socioeconomic status - just to name a few. Egypt is a crowded, poluted country that during the summer months is very hot and dusty. Even after a shower it is possible to step outside and after only a few minutes, feel hot, grimy and sweaty as if you haven't showered at all.

Egyptian men (and women) do take great care of their appearance. When I lived in the States I was frequently in the habit of running out to the grocery store in my pajamas, with my hair tied back - no makeup. You would be hard pressed to find an Egyptian who would dare venture out of their house in this condition. Even just to go run an errand Egyptians are dressed to the nines. Clean, well pressed clothes, makeup, hair done, perfume, etc. So have they gone to all this effort without a shower? Probably not.

Poverty is a big problem here and there are many who are living in less than ideal conditions. It is possible to run into people who simply cover themselves with perfume resulting in a very bad smell.

Also, bearing in mind that Egypt is an Islamic country, and the majority of people dress accordingly. The only people you really see wearing shorts or tank tops are the tourists. During the summer (when it is unbearably hot) you will still find most Egyptian women under layers of clothes, scarves and sometimes black abayas. Of course as Americans we look at that as odd and extremely uncomfortable. The result - they sweat more and produce a strong body odor. Oral hygiene is often somewhat lacking in Egypt also.

If you plan to live in Egypt, you cannot avoid the possibility of bumping into the occasional bad smelling person. As far as your fiance is concerned, the only way you will get to know his own personal habits is to see for yourself. After all, he is the only one that should matter to you.
 
Posted by Shooky (Member # 14776) on :
 
i am a muslim man, i smell like rotten fish. so as my other 3 million brothers. like it or leave it.

But lol at this question. its personal. i have seen many americans that smell like crap. boys and girls lol. thats like me asking does christians eat chicken often?
 
Posted by Sashyra8 (Member # 14488) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Shooky:
i am a muslim man, i smell like rotten fish. so as my other 3 million brothers. like it or leave it.

But lol at this question. its personal. i have seen many americans that smell like crap. boys and girls lol. thats like me asking does christians eat chicken often?
[Eek!]
 
Posted by Momma_Dukes (Member # 14252) on :
 
ok yall let me lay it out for her, ya know me....

despite the stereotypes, arabic men and woman are MILLIONS of times cleaner than american. they wash 5 times a day to pray...they rinse their mouths out after they eat and wash they hands, they LOVE cologne and nice clothes, they love a very clean house and arabic women never have nasty houses, unlike so many american women have, they wash after sex AND clean the sheets, and unlike americans who go to the bathroom and just use a dry piece of tissue and wipe the mess here and there and call your ass 'clean', they all use bidets and if there is no bidets, the keep a cup near the toilet to wash with. also men and women shave the hair from theyre parts to avoid funk.

i been with 2 american men in my life sexually and it was the effing nastiest...you think they were hot and cute and had it going on and all til you saw what their hygiene habits were and needless to say, i didnt go the whole mile with them.
all the arabic men i been with were the cleanest neatest things ever....and they are foxier naked also.

=)
 
Posted by Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Dubai Girl:
Hygiene is a personal thing. It's got nothing to do with where you're from or what religion you practise.

 
Posted by Shisha-Master (Member # 14189) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
I am in the U.S., wanting to marry an Egyptian muslim man. I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men? How often do they shower? Do they smell odd also (again compared with american men). Sorry for the odd question, thanks.
Yeah dude, we take showers every 4 months, and baths on the 2 eids only. What a waste of water I say!

Just use any left over sand paper from house renovations to sand off any layers of dirt, leaves you nice and smooth too!
 
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 
you mean I was supposed to take a bath last Eid too? [Eek!]
 
Posted by ExptinCAI (Member # 1439) on :
 
actually, in another post you state:

" I may marry a man in egypt next month. We are both muslim and plan to marry in a mosque there."

So obviously this isn't a case of religious intolerance.

In fact, it sort of (sadly) sounds like a case of newly-converted-muslim born on US soil who never used her passport and is culturally-ignorant.
 
Posted by young at heart (Member # 10365) on :
 
Well I had a bath at Christmas so I'm fine till Easter [Razz]
 
Posted by ExptinCAI (Member # 1439) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Momma_Dukes:
ok yall let me lay it out for her, ya know me....

despite the stereotypes, arabic men and woman are MILLIONS of times cleaner than american. they wash 5 times a day to pray...they rinse their mouths out after they eat and wash they hands, they LOVE cologne and nice clothes, they love a very clean house and arabic women never have nasty houses, unlike so many american women have, they wash after sex AND clean the sheets, and unlike americans who go to the bathroom and just use a dry piece of tissue and wipe the mess here and there and call your ass 'clean', they all use bidets and if there is no bidets, the keep a cup near the toilet to wash with. also men and women shave the hair from theyre parts to avoid funk.

i been with 2 american men in my life sexually and it was the effing nastiest...you think they were hot and cute and had it going on and all til you saw what their hygiene habits were and needless to say, i didnt go the whole mile with them.
all the arabic men i been with were the cleanest neatest things ever....and they are foxier naked also.

=)
Out of curiosity, Momma Dukes, how many times have you visited any part of what is generally agreed upon as countries of "arabic men and women" (or even what you define as "arabic")

I find it amusing that you think because muslims pray 5x a day, that in modern times, this religious habit somehow translates into superior personal hygiene. (Woe, to those dirty christian puritans who you celebrate every thanksgiving who stank to high heavens and refused to bathe at the gentle nudges of the native inhabitants.)

You have clearly never had to endure a prolonged train/bus/metro in different countries, where your mind wandered and perversely compared the smells down the years...(after all, smell is does trigger our strongest memories) ...and thought ah, yes....this country has YET to embrace the wonder of the deodorant stick and in their francophile-induced stubbornness, clings onto the belief dousing oneself with copious amounts of cologne/perfume will somehow defeat one's distinct stink.
 
Posted by VanillaBullshit (Member # 10873) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
I am in the U.S., wanting to marry an Egyptian muslim man. I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men? How often do they shower? Do they smell odd also (again compared with american men). Sorry for the odd question, thanks.
So how often do you douche?

Do you smell like anchovies?


Remember to sniff your man well when you finally meet, that way you can make a decision based on a solid foundation.
 
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by young at heart:
Well I had a bath at Christmas so I'm fine till Easter [Razz]
But you're a Scot so thats normal [Big Grin]
 
Posted by young at heart (Member # 10365) on :
 
Hey crone, We don't believe in wasting water. After all it's in such short supply here [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 
True. Thats always puzzled me how an Island surrounded by water has water shortages if it doesnt rain for a week and here in the desert there is no shortage [Confused] which makes Egyptians cleaner [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Shisha-Master (Member # 14189) on :
 
The water filters/pumps probably break down. Unless you want to drink sea water there's still going to be a shortage of clean water. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Momma_Dukes (Member # 14252) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ExptinCAI:
quote:
Originally posted by Momma_Dukes:
ok yall let me lay it out for her, ya know me....

despite the stereotypes, arabic men and woman are MILLIONS of times cleaner than american. they wash 5 times a day to pray...they rinse their mouths out after they eat and wash they hands, they LOVE cologne and nice clothes, they love a very clean house and arabic women never have nasty houses, unlike so many american women have, they wash after sex AND clean the sheets, and unlike americans who go to the bathroom and just use a dry piece of tissue and wipe the mess here and there and call your ass 'clean', they all use bidets and if there is no bidets, the keep a cup near the toilet to wash with. also men and women shave the hair from theyre parts to avoid funk.

i been with 2 american men in my life sexually and it was the effing nastiest...you think they were hot and cute and had it going on and all til you saw what their hygiene habits were and needless to say, i didnt go the whole mile with them.
all the arabic men i been with were the cleanest neatest things ever....and they are foxier naked also.

=)
Out of curiosity, Momma Dukes, how many times have you visited any part of what is generally agreed upon as countries of "arabic men and women" (or even what you define as "arabic")

I find it amusing that you think because muslims pray 5x a day, that in modern times, this religious habit somehow translates into superior personal hygiene. (Woe, to those dirty christian puritans who you celebrate every thanksgiving who stank to high heavens and refused to bathe at the gentle nudges of the native inhabitants.)

You have clearly never had to endure a prolonged train/bus/metro in different countries, where your mind wandered and perversely compared the smells down the years...(after all, smell is does trigger our strongest memories) ...and thought ah, yes....this country has YET to embrace the wonder of the deodorant stick and in their francophile-induced stubbornness, clings onto the belief dousing oneself with copious amounts of cologne/perfume will somehow defeat one's distinct stink.
im comparing the arab men i know living in the states to american men in general. i dont care about the ones living in egypt...i know they can tend to fester and thats why u wont catch me going there cuz im bound to punch someone in the lip if they smell like sh*t and try to sit beside me. i been to egypt, and trust me, i know. i was assuming this person has met her man in her own country....but maybe its just another old lady who snagged another bum from a village.
 
Posted by young at heart (Member # 10365) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ayisha:
True. Thats always puzzled me how an Island surrounded by water has water shortages if it doesnt rain for a week and here in the desert there is no shortage [Confused] which makes Egyptians cleaner [Big Grin]
I know we have hose pipe bans within weeks of floods. Madness [Eek!]
 
Posted by ExptinCAI (Member # 1439) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Momma_Dukes:]i dont care about the ones living in egypt...i know they can tend to fester and thats why u wont catch me going there cuz im bound to punch someone in the lip if they smell like sh*t and try to sit beside me. i been to egypt, and trust me, i know. [/QB]
Ah.

Erm, so why are you bothering posting to a forum called egyptsearch then?

*cuz white boyz ain't gonna touch that?* perhaps?

Pathetic.
 
Posted by anthropos 2.0 (Member # 9410) on :
 
Well I have only been with one Egyptian man but he is by far the cleanest man I have met in my life. Always takes a shower once a day, changes his underwear everyday, puts on cologne, combs his hair, and takes good care of his appearances. I can't complain about him in this department. He probably has something to complain about in me however hehehe... last time I shaved my legs was at Christmas! [Smile]
 
Posted by Shooky (Member # 14776) on :
 
um when i stay over my gf's house she always says she loves me scent and she loves to smell my scent on her sheets the next day. is that a good thing
 
Posted by Shisha-Master (Member # 14189) on :
 
Not always, depends on what your "scent" smells like, she might like dog anus for all we know. [Razz]
 
Posted by Sashyra8 (Member # 14488) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Shooky:
um when i stay over my gf's house she always says she loves me scent and she loves to smell my scent on her sheets the next day. is that a good thing
Still remember your virgin whinings when you arrive to this board,Shooky,but now you've even gotten all raunchy!!! [Big Grin]
 
Posted by weirdkitty (Member # 15365) on :
 
What makes you think you are ready to marry the man if you don't even know how clean he is and what he smells like?!

Would you marry an American man without knowing that basic information first?
What is it about these men that make women lose their heads and want to rush to marriage after a few nice msn conversations?
 
Posted by roqayya (Member # 16255) on :
 
Wow....I am 17, met this man online 4 months ago and am planning to check him out with my mother next month. I have never been out of the country before, and there are certain things I am curious about regarding egypt and the middle east. I posted on this board to get a clue as to habits there, and I just get sarcastic, judgemental answers for the most part. Thanks a lot (some sarcasm in return). But true thanks to those who actually helped by giving a sincere answer. You are the ones I care about hearing from.
 
Posted by Shooky (Member # 14776) on :
 
i think you should finish high school and college first then worry about marriage. kinda crazy rnt you
 
Posted by Shooky (Member # 14776) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Sashyra8:
quote:
Originally posted by Shooky:
um when i stay over my gf's house she always says she loves me scent and she loves to smell my scent on her sheets the next day. is that a good thing
Still remember your virgin whinings when you arrive to this board,Shooky,but now you've even gotten all raunchy!!! [Big Grin]
ya i remember [Smile]
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ExptinCAI:
actually, in another post you state:


In fact, it sort of (sadly) sounds like a case of newly-converted-muslim born on US soil who never used her passport and is culturally-ignorant.
Give the girl a break. Culturally-ignorant? Of course she doesn't know anything about Egypt. How could she - she has never been there. But ignorance does not come from asking a question. It comes from NOT ASKING.

At least she is attempting to educate herself, is open minded and curious.
 
Posted by LovedOne (Member # 10222) on :
 
She should still be asking her intended husband these questions instead of a bunch of strangers.
If she can't discuss this simple of a subject with him, what else aren't they discussing?

There is nothing wrong with being curious, or wanting to learn, but some common sense and open communication with those are you supposed to be close with would help alot.
 
Posted by Tibe-at-work (Member # 14907) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by ExptinCAI:
actually, in another post you state:


In fact, it sort of (sadly) sounds like a case of newly-converted-muslim born on US soil who never used her passport and is culturally-ignorant.
Give the girl a break. Culturally-ignorant? Of course she doesn't know anything about Egypt. How could she - she has never been there. But ignorance does not come from asking a question. It comes from NOT ASKING.

At least she is attempting to educate herself, is open minded and curious.
Very good answer.
 
Posted by Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by ExptinCAI:
actually, in another post you state:


In fact, it sort of (sadly) sounds like a case of newly-converted-muslim born on US soil who never used her passport and is culturally-ignorant.
Give the girl a break. Culturally-ignorant? Of course she doesn't know anything about Egypt. How could she - she has never been there. But ignorance does not come from asking a question. It comes from NOT ASKING.

At least she is attempting to educate herself, is open minded and curious.
It's more about common sense which she obviously lacks completely. Hence in one sentence she's able to offend one half of a nation.

"I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men?"

Roqayya just come to Egypt and get your fair share of sniffs. You haven't experienced smell yet (dunno with what you have been hanging out in the past to come to such a judgement anyway). [Confused]
 
Posted by Mimmi (Member # 3606) on :
 
At least she is attempting to educate herself, is open minded and curious. [/QB][/QUOTE]

She should still be educating herself at school and not go and get married at 17 to some egyptian whom she has never even met.
She has never been outside of USA, she should travel and see the world and learn about different cultures and the smells.
Start with Egypt but don't get married.
 
Posted by Tibe-at-work (Member # 14907) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mimmi:
At least she is attempting to educate herself, is open minded and curious.
She should still be educating herself at school and not go and get married at 17 to some egyptian whom she has never even met.
She has never been outside of USA, she should travel and see the world and learn about different cultures and the smells.
Start with Egypt but don't get married. [/QB][/QUOTE]

WOOOOW she is 17??? that detail slipped my eye - STAY HOME GIRL GO TO SCHOOL AND FIND YOURSELF A COLLEGEDUDE TO HANG AROUND INSTED!!!!!!!!

Listen to Mama Mimmi and Mama Tibe! [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Tibe-at-work:
STAY HOME GIRL GO TO SCHOOL AND FIND YOURSELF A COLLEGEDUDE TO HANG AROUND INSTED
A CLEAN one!!
 
Posted by dolphin redsea (Member # 11209) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by VanillaBullshit:
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
I am in the U.S., wanting to marry an Egyptian muslim man. I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men? How often do they shower? Do they smell odd also (again compared with american men). Sorry for the odd question, thanks.
So how often do you douche?

Do you smell like anchovies?


Remember to sniff your man well when you finally meet, that way you can make a decision based on a solid foundation.
[Big Grin] [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Hermione Heliotrope. (Member # 14248) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Momma_Dukes:
ok yall let me lay it out for her, ya know me....

despite the stereotypes, arabic men and woman are MILLIONS of times cleaner than american. they wash 5 times a day to pray...they rinse their mouths out after they eat and wash they hands, they LOVE cologne and nice clothes, they love a very clean house and arabic women never have nasty houses, unlike so many american women have, they wash after sex AND clean the sheets, and unlike americans who go to the bathroom and just use a dry piece of tissue and wipe the mess here and there and call your ass 'clean', they all use bidets and if there is no bidets, the keep a cup near the toilet to wash with. also men and women shave the hair from theyre parts to avoid funk.

i been with 2 american men in my life sexually and it was the effing nastiest...you think they were hot and cute and had it going on and all til you saw what their hygiene habits were and needless to say, i didnt go the whole mile with them.
all the arabic men i been with were the cleanest neatest things ever....and they are foxier naked also.

=)
[Big Grin]

Can't argue with that mama [Wink]

I saw that Doctor Oz guy on Oprah last night and they were talking bidets ( shatafa ) he said that if you had a bit of 'poo' on your hand would you wipe it off using just tissue or would you wash it with water ?

I have to say I never thought of it like that but he did have a point.
 
Posted by Sashyra8 (Member # 14488) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by ExptinCAI:
actually, in another post you state:


In fact, it sort of (sadly) sounds like a case of newly-converted-muslim born on US soil who never used her passport and is culturally-ignorant.
Give the girl a break. Culturally-ignorant? Of course she doesn't know anything about Egypt. How could she - she has never been there. But ignorance does not come from asking a question. It comes from NOT ASKING.

At least she is attempting to educate herself, is open minded and curious.
To start to know or learn about a country you don´t have to go there.One only needs the interest,will and compromise to learn.What are books for?,and even easier today,the internet is not there only to chat but it serves to study,too.
Before i visited Egypt the first time on 1998 i already knew quite some. [Cool]
 
Posted by Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
 
I went in 1994 to Egypt for the first time (which was my first trip abroad ever and all by myself) and yes I read a couple of travel books about Egypt before arriving (there was no internet at that time) BUT ....

to tell you the truth - books tell you only so much. The reality hit me really hard, culture shock 110% but I survived it and loved it so much there that I decided to stay way longer than originally planned.
 
Posted by 7up (Member # 16266) on :
 
americans are taught to shower everyday and wash their hair everyday. i donno if egyptian men are taught this
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Tigerlily:


to tell you the truth - books tell you only so much. The reality hit me really hard, culture shock 110%
The guide books - even the ones targeted at ex-pats - do not do a good job to prepare you for real life in Egypt. That is exactly the reason I am writing my own book. An uncensored version of what it is really like here.
 
Posted by Shooky (Member # 14776) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by 7up:
americans are taught to shower everyday and wash their hair everyday. i donno if egyptian men are taught this
I certainly wasnt taught this as a child and so most egyptians i think. guess its because you get dirty as soon as you step outside any ways [Big Grin] . but i am more american than egyptian any ways.. still it all depends on the person! not where hes from
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
Cleanliness is next to godliness.
 
Posted by Sashyra8 (Member # 14488) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by Tigerlily:


to tell you the truth - books tell you only so much. The reality hit me really hard, culture shock 110%
The guide books - even the ones targeted at ex-pats - do not do a good job to prepare you for real life in Egypt. That is exactly the reason I am writing my own book. An uncensored version of what it is really like here.
"uncensored" ROFL [Big Grin] Really like that.

The problem with books is that they get outdated very quick and thus the only real way to get to know and learn about a country's culture is to visit often and talk with locals.
 
Posted by Sashyra8 (Member # 14488) on :
 
Another thing,guidebooks only serve to guide the tourist in a light and superficial way thru the main sights and walk arounds visits.Further and deeper reading on many aspects of the culture would help a lot more.
 
Posted by weirdkitty (Member # 15365) on :
 
Thing is, she will probably go to Egypt, stay in a nice hotel, have some romantic dinners with her guy, where he whispers sweet nothings, and then will come home all loved up thinking she is ready to marry.

I have been five times now, and every time I go it is like another piece of the puzzle. But despite staying with him in a flat, to really get to see what married life and living in Egypt would be like, the puzzle isn't even a quarter finished.
This time I went for nearly a month, and comparing that to when I was there in a hotel, boy, it could have been a totally new world, it is so different. Going there for six months, a year, etc, will also give me a totally different picture. Not just on the culture, but on the guy too.
MSN conversations wont even give you 1% of who he really is, and nor will just romantic dinners, and a sweet goodbye at the hotel door. You have a long way to go before marriage should even enter your head.
 
Posted by Makbeta (Member # 14401) on :
 
And also ... sometimes people change a lot, their ways sort of part - even in a marriage where it seems the partner is taken for granted. The person you marry at, say, 25, might be a totally different person in 10-15 years' time... It's always a risk. Sadly.
 
Posted by Sashyra8 (Member # 14488) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by weirdkitty:
Thing is, she will probably go to Egypt, stay in a nice hotel, have some romantic dinners with her guy, where he whispers sweet nothings, and then will come home all loved up thinking she is ready to marry.

I have been five times now, and every time I go it is like another piece of the puzzle. But despite staying with him in a flat, to really get to see what married life and living in Egypt would be like, the puzzle isn't even a quarter finished.
This time I went for nearly a month, and comparing that to when I was there in a hotel, boy, it could have been a totally new world, it is so different. Going there for six months, a year, etc, will also give me a totally different picture. Not just on the culture, but on the guy too.
MSN conversations wont even give you 1% of who he really is, and nor will just romantic dinners, and a sweet goodbye at the hotel door. You have a long way to go before marriage should even enter your head.
This is better called marriage express direct-plunge from MSN/YAHOO/AOL...you name it! [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by Tigerlily:


to tell you the truth - books tell you only so much. The reality hit me really hard, culture shock 110%
The guide books - even the ones targeted at ex-pats - do not do a good job to prepare you for real life in Egypt. That is exactly the reason I am writing my own book. An uncensored version of what it is really like here.
I wasn't really living an expat style kind of life there in the beginning as I lived with an Egyptian family 24/7 and looked after their offspring.

On top of it I never travelled abroad before so I felt like in a total different world. The first time I saw palms in my life, saw Egyptians (I saw only a few foreigners before in my hometown), heard people speaking Arabic with each other (well I caught a little already on the airplane) but it was indeed an overwhelming experience - ah and I don't regret it. When I remember right I didn't even have enough money to go back home so I had to stay there and make the best out of it. And I did!! [Smile]

Oh good luck with your book. Reserve a copy for me when it's done!!
 
Posted by Pillar (Member # 16147) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by weirdkitty:
Thing is, she will probably go to Egypt, stay in a nice hotel, have some romantic dinners with her guy, where he whispers sweet nothings, and then will come home all loved up thinking she is ready to marry.

I have been five times now, and every time I go it is like another piece of the puzzle. But despite staying with him in a flat, to really get to see what married life and living in Egypt would be like, the puzzle isn't even a quarter finished.
This time I went for nearly a month, and comparing that to when I was there in a hotel, boy, it could have been a totally new world, it is so different. Going there for six months, a year, etc, will also give me a totally different picture. Not just on the culture, but on the guy too.
MSN conversations wont even give you 1% of who he really is, and nor will just romantic dinners, and a sweet goodbye at the hotel door. You have a long way to go before marriage should even enter your head.
With respect kitty, what you are talking about doesnt exactly fit with how 'muslims' do things, and she is a muslim. She would be getting married before living with him, thats the point.

Of course she isn't going to know everything about him, but i disagree that speaking to him only tells her 1%... Of course it tells her more than that.

You will constantly learn about your partner, once married, once you live together, have kids, hit problems, etc etc. There is no way on this earth that you can know someone 100% UNTIL you live together daily as man and wife (or co-habit, if thats your thing)

In addition, not everyone can afford to travel to egypt 5 times a year, or to stay for 4 weeks at a time. Most people have work or family commitments that prevent this.

I agree with you that spending as much time with the person prior to marriage is the most sensible thing to do. I also agree that romantic dinners and staying in nice hotels is not reality, but be careful you dont turn into one of the ES cynics [Wink]


I can understand why people would jump down this poor girls throat because she asked whether Egyptian men were clean, but please give her a break.

She is 17, she is still young and how does she know? She doesnt want to offend him so she asks here, where's the crime?
Most egyptians consider western people pretty stinky due to personal habits, such as using toilet paper rather than water!

And where did she ask advice about whether she SHOULD get married or not? Everyone is quick to jump on top of her telling her she cant possibly know him well enough...how do you know?

Her own MOTHER is going with her to check him out and see if he is a nice guy etc etc, where is the harm in that?

It makes me laugh how people can judge a woman who wants to get married as 'rushing into things' but not a woman who dates a man?! Its almost as if it has become so backward in Some countries that its now more acceptable to have many boyfriends than get married?

I do hope that all those who are saying she is 'rushing into things' have not had sex with their boyfriends for at least the first 4 months, or however long you are suggesting she 'wait' - otherwise that might just be a tad hypocrytical...its like saying your body is worth less than marriage and its ok to date and have sex, as long as you dont get married??

Furthermore, the comment on muslims being 'clean' due to them washing 5 times a day is untrue. Muslims SHOULD be clean, but many are not, so as someone else said, its down to personal hygiene habits and one persons idea of clean might differ to someone elses.

I am glad your mum is going with you Roqayya and I hope you have a nice time [Smile]
 
Posted by weirdkitty (Member # 15365) on :
 
quote:
With respect kitty, what you are talking about doesnt exactly fit with how 'muslims' do things, and she is a muslim. She would be getting married before living with him, thats the point.
She is a Muslim? I must have missed that. In fact, due to her asking about the bathing habits of muslims, I assumed she was a bit clueless about them.

quote:
Of course she isn't going to know everything about him, but i disagree that speaking to him only tells her 1%... Of course it tells her more than that.
It tells her what he wants it to tell her. That can be a lot, or it can be a bunch of lies. Even still, how me and Sam talk to each other online is nothing compared to how we are when we are together. It is a totally different side to the relationship.
You are right, you can never know someone 100%, especially not before living together for at least a decade. However, I bet she wouldn’t dream of marrying an American man after only speaking online, so why lose her head with an Egyptian guy?

Yes, most people can’t be as lucky as me going as much as possible. This doesn’t mean they shouldn’t, it means it will just take longer- years of travelling, instead of just letting one visit tell you everything. And she is only 17, best to wait anyway.

How many times on here have there been threads with new wives moaning about how it wasn’t what they expected, how their men beat them, how they can’t live with their guys little habits, etc etc etc. How many people got divorced less than two years after getting married? Many of these marriages shouldn’t have even taken place, but the woman was too loved up on a holiday romance/internet fling.

I’m not becoming cynical, I’ve always said people should enter these relationships with their wits about them. And, know the guy properly, then it can indeed work, just like any other relationship.
 
Posted by MoDeStY (Member # 5554) on :
 
roqayya sounds like a Muslim name are you a Muslim by any chance??

Now if you are Muslim then you would know that Tahara (Purity) in islam is wajib (obligatory)..

After having sex in islam with the wiffy of course (and not some leftovers) , it is a must to have something called Qhusul(shower).

After empting your stomach from any filth on the bathroom, in Islam you have to wash your genital yes that include the back door..

Muslims makes Ablution Before Prayers 5 times a day, and they use siwak or toothbrush before each salt (prayer).

They shower each Jom3a (friday) note: not on fridays only as he might be having sex with his wife each day or even had a wetty dream which in that case he has to take a shower..

Muslim men pie while sitting as their Prophets use to do that May Allahs peace and blessings be upon them..

and there are more to this topic..


But it all comes down on how much he Practises his religion..

As there are some half Muslims out there they take some parts of Islam and leave the rest..

Now if you are not Muslim he will be most likely be more worried about your hygiene unless he will block that thought until he gets his Visa..

Anyhow best wishes..
 
Posted by weirdkitty (Member # 15365) on :
 
quote:
And where did she ask advice about whether she SHOULD get married or not? Everyone is quick to jump on top of her telling her she cant possibly know him well enough...how do you know?
And when I first joined everyone was oh so lovely to me right, ermmmmm. You know you were one of the worst to me in my intro post, so I find it weird that you gave a 21 year old girl who had met the guy a hasher time then a 17 year old with an internet fling.
And you know what, I’m actually glad you and others were harsh to me. We would be irresponsible if we didn’t tell people the red flags when we can see potential danger ahead. I learnt the dangers of him asking for money, what he should and shouldn’t do, what to expect, the tricks and lies used, etc. I have kept my eyes wide open throughout my relationship, sure, doesn’t sound romantic, but it means I decreases my chances of marrying a conner or stranger.
I would tell any 17 year old they were not ready to marry, even if it was with another English guy she had been dating for years. Gods, I was 17 only five years ago, and I can think back and confidently state I would never have been ready.
If this girl loved the man so much, his bathing habits wouldn’t even be an issue anyway.
 
Posted by LovedOne (Member # 10222) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
roqayya sounds like a Muslim name are you a Muslim by any chance??
How many people sign on here with their real names?
I'd guess almost none.
She can make up any name she likes.

And what exactly makes a Muslim name? Surely you mean Arabic... [Roll Eyes]
 
Posted by Sashyra8 (Member # 14488) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
roqayya sounds like a Muslim name are you a Muslim by any chance??
How many people sign on here with their real names?
I'd guess almost none.
She can make up any name she likes.

And what exactly makes a Muslim name? Surely you mean Arabic... [Roll Eyes]
Good one,LovedOne [Wink]
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Tigerlily:


Oh good luck with your book. Reserve a copy for me when it's done!!
This book is not going to be just another run of the mill touristy, ex-pat, where can I get my haircut in Cairo type of book. It is going to deal in a huge way with cultural things exactly like what this original post did.

I am not aiming my book at people who already live in Cairo, but at people like this 17 year old girl who are clueless about this country and the men they are meeting on the internet. There are thousands out there just like her who desperately need to understand Egyptian Culture through the eyes of their fellow countrymen who have already "been there and done that".

Send you a copy of the book? Sure, but better yet - you could be in it. I am looking for people to interview for it. I can even change your name to protect the innocent [Smile]
 
Posted by MoDeStY (Member # 5554) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
roqayya sounds like a Muslim name are you a Muslim by any chance??
How many people sign on here with their real names?
I'd guess almost none.
She can make up any name she likes.

And what exactly makes a Muslim name? Surely you mean Arabic... [Roll Eyes]
Not only Arabic but also Roqqeya is one of Prophet Mohamed daughter's Name (may Allah's peace and blessings be upon him. Now if she would go with Alias like Hana, sana, sumer,fada ect ect I wouldn't ask cuz they are common names by all Arabs Muslims and non-muslims but names Like Roqqeya, Aisha, khadija, fatima ect ect are commonly used by Muslims only, So I pardon your ignorance for not knowing the History of the name Roqqeya..

I'm out >>>>
 
Posted by LovedOne (Member # 10222) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
roqayya sounds like a Muslim name are you a Muslim by any chance??
How many people sign on here with their real names?
I'd guess almost none.
She can make up any name she likes.

And what exactly makes a Muslim name? Surely you mean Arabic... [Roll Eyes]
Not only Arabic but also Roqqeya is one of Prophet Mohamed daughter's Name (may Allah's peace and blessings be upon him. Now if she would go with Alias like Hana, sana, sumer,fada ect ect I wouldn't ask cuz they are common names by all Arabs Muslims and non-muslims but names Like Roqqeya, Aisha, khadija, fatima ect ect are commonly used by Muslims only, So I pardon your ignorance for not knowing the History of the name Roqqeya..

I'm out >>>>
As first posted by the original poster and starter of the thread:
quote:
I am in the U.S., wanting to marry an Egyptian muslim man. I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men? How often do they shower? Do they smell odd also (again compared with american men). Sorry for the odd question, thanks.
Does this poster sound like a Muslim to you, one who was born Muslim or knows alot about Islam? It sure doesn't sound like it to me. Anyone can pick a name, maybe it is what her "intended" husband decided she should go by. Just because she has the name doesn't mean she was born with it or knows where it comes from and judging from her post I'd say she could claim neither of those facts.
I'm perfectly willing to accept being wrong on that, if she wants to come and explain otherwise.
 
Posted by Pillar (Member # 16147) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by weirdkitty:
quote:
And where did she ask advice about whether she SHOULD get married or not? Everyone is quick to jump on top of her telling her she cant possibly know him well enough...how do you know?
And when I first joined everyone was oh so lovely to me right, ermmmmm. You know you were one of the worst to me in my intro post, so I find it weird that you gave a 21 year old girl who had met the guy a hasher time then a 17 year old with an internet fling.
And you know what, I’m actually glad you and others were harsh to me. We would be irresponsible if we didn’t tell people the red flags when we can see potential danger ahead. I learnt the dangers of him asking for money, what he should and shouldn’t do, what to expect, the tricks and lies used, etc. I have kept my eyes wide open throughout my relationship, sure, doesn’t sound romantic, but it means I decreases my chances of marrying a conner or stranger.
I would tell any 17 year old they were not ready to marry, even if it was with another English guy she had been dating for years. Gods, I was 17 only five years ago, and I can think back and confidently state I would never have been ready.
If this girl loved the man so much, his bathing habits wouldn’t even be an issue anyway.
The ONLY reason I was harsh with you was because you were saying you were going to Egypt to stay with your 'muslim' man and you wouldnt marry someone without sleeping with them etc etc. Anyway, lets not go back over that, you DID marry him, so you could spend time 'getting to know him', so technically, in your eyes, you dont even SEE this as marriage. You see it as 'dating' not marriage, but you did it so others would see it as marriage. Its a bit of a paradox.

Basically what you did was something that enabled you to do everything with each other, without you feeling like you were properly married. This girl wants to marry someone because she wants to get married first presumably.

Yes there is an element of risk in that, we would see it that way particularly, because its not what we grew up with.

Also, not all women who have stories of relationships that havent worked with Egyptian men, met on the net or on holiday, similarly some met on the net and are doing fine. Its really all just about the people involved.
 
Posted by MoDeStY (Member # 5554) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
roqayya sounds like a Muslim name are you a Muslim by any chance??
How many people sign on here with their real names?
I'd guess almost none.
She can make up any name she likes.

And what exactly makes a Muslim name? Surely you mean Arabic... [Roll Eyes]
Not only Arabic but also Roqqeya is one of Prophet Mohamed daughter's Name (may Allah's peace and blessings be upon him. Now if she would go with Alias like Hana, sana, sumer,fada ect ect I wouldn't ask cuz they are common names by all Arabs Muslims and non-muslims but names Like Roqqeya, Aisha, khadija, fatima ect ect are commonly used by Muslims only, So I pardon your ignorance for not knowing the History of the name Roqqeya..

I'm out >>>>
As first posted by the original poster and starter of the thread:
quote:
I am in the U.S., wanting to marry an Egyptian muslim man. I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men? How often do they shower? Do they smell odd also (again compared with american men). Sorry for the odd question, thanks.
Does this poster sound like a Muslim to you, one who was born Muslim or knows alot about Islam? It sure doesn't sound like it to me. Anyone can pick a name, maybe it is what her "intended" husband decided she should go by. Just because she has the name doesn't mean she was born with it or knows where it comes from and judging from her post I'd say she could claim neither of those facts.
I'm perfectly willing to accept being wrong on that, if she wants to come and explain otherwise.
She my sister in islam Roqqeya opened another thread something about 'Legal marriage' and 'both being muslims' I guess that clears it out then she is a muslim w alhmdulillah..
 
Posted by Pillar (Member # 16147) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
roqayya sounds like a Muslim name are you a Muslim by any chance??
How many people sign on here with their real names?
I'd guess almost none.
She can make up any name she likes.

And what exactly makes a Muslim name? Surely you mean Arabic... [Roll Eyes]
Not only Arabic but also Roqqeya is one of Prophet Mohamed daughter's Name (may Allah's peace and blessings be upon him. Now if she would go with Alias like Hana, sana, sumer,fada ect ect I wouldn't ask cuz they are common names by all Arabs Muslims and non-muslims but names Like Roqqeya, Aisha, khadija, fatima ect ect are commonly used by Muslims only, So I pardon your ignorance for not knowing the History of the name Roqqeya..

I'm out >>>>
As first posted by the original poster and starter of the thread:
quote:
I am in the U.S., wanting to marry an Egyptian muslim man. I am kind of worried about bathing - do muslim men there keep themselves pretty clean, as compared to american men? How often do they shower? Do they smell odd also (again compared with american men). Sorry for the odd question, thanks.
Does this poster sound like a Muslim to you, one who was born Muslim or knows alot about Islam? It sure doesn't sound like it to me. Anyone can pick a name, maybe it is what her "intended" husband decided she should go by. Just because she has the name doesn't mean she was born with it or knows where it comes from and judging from her post I'd say she could claim neither of those facts.
I'm perfectly willing to accept being wrong on that, if she wants to come and explain otherwise.
So now she needs to come and explain her name and how long she has been a muslim, so that the people of ES can decide whether she is muslim enough to do what exactly?
 
Posted by LovedOne (Member # 10222) on :
 
Yes, I saw that thread and gave her the information she needed. If I knew at the time that she was only 17 and knew seemingly nothing about Muslims as she has so obviously pointed out in this thread, though she says she is Muslim, I might have thought twice about facilitating what could be a very big problem.

I am married to a Muslim man and I am Muslim myself, I am not picking on her about being Muslim, but she is seemingly ignorant about alot of issues and even basic facts, and going into a marriage this way is just asking for alot of trouble. She has known this man for only 4 months, and only online, she has never met him in person. Ask her how long she has been Muslim.

I am not wishing her any harm, but it seems that both you and the original poster need to open your eyes.

** I was only asking about how long she had been Muslim, because she is fairly ignorant about some things. I could personally care less how long she has been Muslim. I just think knowing how long she's been Muslim might explain a few things.
 
Posted by Pillar (Member # 16147) on :
 
Well I thank you for your suggestion about opening my eyes, but I think they are just fine thank you.

She is going on a trip with her mother, I am sure her mother is going so that she can use her years of experience to check the situation out.

There are many muslims, born and reverts with different levels of understanding. Who knows what hers is, I certainly dont.

Why will her marriage be a problem? How do you or anyone else know that? I agree that you can of course tell her things to look out for, but thats the same in any relationship. I just dont see why everyone has to be so down on her, firstly for not being 'muslim' enough and secondly for wanting to get married instead of having a boyfriend.
 
Posted by Shisha-Master (Member # 14189) on :
 
She's 17 ?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v374/scbikesrider/lollerskates.gif

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v374/scbikesrider/LOL-ROFL_Copter.gif
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
Hey Ministry of Common Sense... I so hope there is a job going on ES for you as there are so many eejits knocking about we really need your Ministry.

Let me know if I can help at all... I guess I am pretty unique as I did not come here to sniff a guy or to live/associate with a man I hardly knew (married or unmarried)... I came here for a whole different reason and even though it has been predicted I am yet to be miserable, groped, have a hard time or receive a culture shock [Big Grin] and I love love love my life here [Big Grin] maybe I am just one of the lucky ones who has fitted in and adapted with my surroundings...

Please file me under H for happy [Big Grin]

As for the whole name thing, if you seriously can imagine a Ferret sitting here typing then I thing the Ministry of Common Sense should begin as of now!

WK... I told you from day one, nobody likes happy people and you will be crapped on at every turn as a matter of course until you are miserable and folk can say 'i told you so' [Wink]

Any how folks, good to saee some old shite being raked back up, perhaps it will help with my insomnia [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Pillar (Member # 16147) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Ferret:


WK... I told you from day one, nobody likes happy people and you will be crapped on at every turn as a matter of course until you are miserable and folk can say 'i told you so' [Wink]

I haven't seen anyone crapping on WK, unless you call having a difference of opinion 'crapping'?

I think more 'crap' comes from people who make war where there isn't any.

PMSL ROFL LOL [Wink] [Roll Eyes] [Big Grin] (did I get them all in?)
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
you missed LMAO... ffs. oh and lmfao... stb!
 
Posted by LovedOne (Member # 10222) on :
 
After all is said and done, I don't wish this girl any harm, and I harbor no ill will towards her.

I just have some concerns about what she is doing, as it seems some others here do as well. These concerns are not about being right (at least on my part), they are about trying to protect someone who might not know what they are getting into.

There was some getting off track there in the middle, but alas... such is the nature of ES, and why I tend to avoid it for long periods of time. [Big Grin]

May Allah guide her to what is best!
 
Posted by Shisha-Master (Member # 14189) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Ferret:
I am yet to be miserable, groped, have a hard time or receive a culture shock
I can provide one or two of those if you want. [Razz]

(the misery and a bad time, hehehe)
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
Nothing you say or do can shock me!!! [Wink]

As for the bad time, dude, the hash here is too good for that to be believable.

And for the record, you do not smell either!
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Ferret:
Hey Ministry of Common Sense... I so hope there is a job going on ES for you as there are so many eejits knocking about we really need your Ministry.

Let me know if I can help at all... I guess I am pretty unique as I did not come here to sniff a guy or to live/associate with a man I hardly knew (married or unmarried)... I came here for a whole different reason and even though it has been predicted I am yet to be miserable, groped, have a hard time or receive a culture shock [Big Grin] and I love love love my life here [Big Grin] maybe I am just one of the lucky ones who has fitted in and adapted with my surroundings...

Don't worry LF you are already on tap to be interviewed for my book (and your mother and father) - I just need to find some time to catch up with you. Seems like we chatted more when we were living in different countries. I have been so busy these days.....Egypt tends to have that effect on you.

And by the way, The Ministry of Common Sense is up and running.........
 
Posted by *Dalia* (Member # 13012) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:

Muslim men pie while sitting
ROFL.

You should have seen the reaction of some Muslim men to the "please sit down while peeing" sign in my bathroom. [Big Grin]

A typical case of selective use of ahadeeth, btw. [Wink]


quote:
Originally posted by Lady Ferret:
I guess I am pretty unique as I did not come here to sniff a guy or to live/associate with a man I hardly knew (married or unmarried)...
No, you're not. There are lots of women in Cairo who came for all sorts of reasons without a guy being involved, myself included.
It's just that they tend to be the minority on boards like this one. [Wink]
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
I know, we chat so little now. That is what happens when you have such a fabulous busy and hectic life [Big Grin] Not a bad thing really is it.

Are you going to include the letter you found?

We should get our heads together about dates to meet up, I could bring the Fokkers with me. I have SO much to tell you about allsorts [Big Grin]

As for the Ministry, seriously chica, who would have thought so many people could be so stupid [Big Grin]
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
Thanks for reminding me about the letter. I almost forgot about it even though it is still on my shelf gathering mounds of dust.

I would love to see you and the Fokkers. It's been a while. I am not working these days so it may be a great opportunity to catch up. I'll call you soon.
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
Just been thinking MOCS... imagine if we were members of this site when we first met... heaven forbid we started to believe a lot of the nonsense about the hardships, trials and tribulations!!! Thank God for reality.

[Wink]
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
I know many people who have lived here for over a decade who would love to help you as well.. maybe you should come over to the club one night snd meet some fresh blood.

I enjoyed that letter, it really did portray how life in Cairo was back in those days... it is a shame the author never stepped forward.

I love the idea for your book, I hate touristic data and advice and this site proves how many types of questions exist about Egypt and the culture. It would be good to get some real life tales.
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
Some people do have genuine hardships, trials and tribulations but for some reason nothing is taken seriously on this forum. It always ends up turning into a mudslinging fest. Which is unfortunate really.

Honestly, if I had a serious problem, this would be the last place I would expose it.
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
The letter was awesome. I really have to try to track down the author.

By the way, you are going to laugh when you hear what the title of my book is going to be.

I will PM it to you now.
 
Posted by mamasue (Member # 4691) on :
 
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Lady Ferret:
[QB]

Let me know if I can help at all... I guess I am pretty unique as I did not come here to sniff a guy or to live/associate with a man I hardly knew (married or unmarried)... I came here for a whole different reason and even though it has been predicted I am yet to be miserable, groped, have a hard time or receive a culture shock [Big Grin] and I love love love my life here [Big Grin] maybe I am just one of the lucky ones who has fitted in and adapted with my surroundings...

Please file me under H for happy [Big Grin]

................................................


Like you, LF, I went to Egypt to live,NOT for any man... and I lived there 4 years without any relationships with Egyptian men.... I was there to work... I also found life in Hurghada suited me very well!!

I was also very happy in Egypt... we may well go back there to live one day.
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
BEZAPT...

I know a few people who have had genuine problems and remarkably not all to do with men!

Nothing is taken seriously on here as it is a joke. I am damn sure if I need genuine advice or friendship this is the last place I would visit!

Did you not see the comment though that all people who live abroad will have a bad time in life at some point? Kinda like the voice of doom casting a spell. My folks have been away from their homeland since 1990 and I guess their bad times will come!!!

Ministry, if I ever have a genuine issue I will call you mate [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by mamasue:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Lady Ferret:
[QB]

Let me know if I can help at all... I guess I am pretty unique as I did not come here to sniff a guy or to live/associate with a man I hardly knew (married or unmarried)... I came here for a whole different reason and even though it has been predicted I am yet to be miserable, groped, have a hard time or receive a culture shock [Big Grin] and I love love love my life here [Big Grin] maybe I am just one of the lucky ones who has fitted in and adapted with my surroundings...

Please file me under H for happy [Big Grin]

................................................


Like you, LF, I went to Egypt to live,NOT for any man... and I lived there 4 years without any relationships with Egyptian men.... I was there to work... I also found life in Hurghada suited me very well!!

I was also very happy in Egypt... we may well go back there to live one day.
SO I am not unique.. dammit

I date guys do not get me wrong. Apparently dating does not exist on ES but however it does in Cairo so I go to the pictures and for meals etc but just like in the UK, they are not always my cup of tea or vice versa...

Cairo suits me, I love my life here. My quality of life is so much better and my general well-being has improved... I cannot foresee me leaving.
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
I PM'd you - let me know what you think!
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Ferret:
BEZAPT...

I know a few people who have had genuine problems and remarkably not all to do with men!

Nothing is taken seriously on here as it is a joke. I am damn sure if I need genuine advice or friendship this is the last place I would visit!


Ministry, if I ever have a genuine issue I will call you mate [Big Grin]
But you know the sad thing is some people have nowhere else to turn - no family or friends. So in that case it is good that a place like this exists. It's just unfortunate that sometimes all people have to offer is sarcasm and snide condescending advice. I truly feel for them sometimes.
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
Oh sure, there was a case the other week that was a genuine cry for help and some people decided to pass judgement rather than help.

As it happens, she knew I was here, she knew I was close and the network worked [Big Grin] We got in touch and that was the end of that...

I know though that those of us who are here have a good network and somehow we are all connected. There is a trend that those who are not here are the most flippant and judgemental.

I am in the sarcastic clan but generally it is aimed at those who cannot see the wood for the trees.
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
Don't forget I am from New York. My first language was SARCASM.
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
IS not WAS

Do you still hate the English* [Wink]

* disclaimer... intended for humoUr only and not to be a talking point about how we are all slappers (again).
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
I love Cadbury Eggs. [Smile]
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
Want me to arrange a consignment?
 
Posted by LovedOne (Member # 10222) on :
 
Moral Superiority complex anyone? [Roll Eyes] [Razz]
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
I would imagine having moral superiority (not necessarily a complex!) is way more socially acceptable than having no morals at all [Big Grin]
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
Moral Superiority complex anyone? [Roll Eyes] [Razz]
No thank you, I just had some.
 
Posted by weirdkitty (Member # 15365) on :
 
quote:
I date guys do not get me wrong. Apparently dating does not exist on ES but however it does in Cairo
No no, don't date- we all know tis a far better thing to marry whilst still a child to a stranger, and divorce a couple years later due to inconsolable differences.

Pillar- you were thinking of the orfi thread- but you jump right on me on my introduction thread, which was only about me wondering if I should go back to Egypt. I did, and 8 months on I still learn things that I'm glad to know before marriage. And I'm glad I wasn’t jumping head first into something naively.
Cleanliness is the last thing that she should worry about- Are his parents going to meet her/Has he ever mentioned money/what are his thoughts on FGM/Where do they want to live/does she cover enough for his liking/will he be ok with her working/does he expect her to do all the cooking and cleaning/is he happy for her to go out alone/is he happy for her to go out with friends/can she speak arabic, and will she learn/if living in egypt, does she understand the different lifestyle/is he overly eager about coming to her country/will his parents approve/will he be violent... etc etc etc.
At 17 does it really make sense to be wondering whether your other half wants to mutilate your little girl one day, or perhaps you should focus on, oh I don't know, education?? It isn't either be married, or be dating. Nor does dating mean you are having sex and babies all over the place. But, marriage at such a young age already has a low success rate, add that in with the fact they met online and have totally different cultures… it makes sense that the best thing is to be extremely careful and to take things extremely slowly.
I’m not saying she shouldn’t be with him (I’m not that much of a hypocrite), just not talking marriage just yet.
 
Posted by xblueskyx (Member # 12289) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by weirdkitty:
quote:
I date guys do not get me wrong. Apparently dating does not exist on ES but however it does in Cairo
No no, don't date- we all know tis a far better thing to marry whilst still a child to a stranger, and divorce a couple years later due to inconsolable differences.

Pillar- you were thinking of the orfi thread- but you jump right on me on my introduction thread, which was only about me wondering if I should go back to Egypt. I did, and 8 months on I still learn things that I'm glad to know before marriage. And I'm glad I wasn’t jumping head first into something naively.
Cleanliness is the last thing that she should worry about- Are his parents going to meet her/Has he ever mentioned money/what are his thoughts on FGM/Where do they want to live/does she cover enough for his liking/will he be ok with her working/does he expect her to do all the cooking and cleaning/is he happy for her to go out alone/is he happy for her to go out with friends/can she speak arabic, and will she learn/if living in egypt, does she understand the different lifestyle/is he overly eager about coming to her country/will his parents approve/will he be violent... etc etc etc.
At 17 does it really make sense to be wondering whether your other half wants to mutilate your little girl one day, or perhaps you should focus on, oh I don't know, education?? It isn't either be married, or be dating. Nor does dating mean you are having sex and babies all over the place. But, marriage at such a young age already has a low success rate, add that in with the fact they met online and have totally different cultures… it makes sense that the best thing is to be extremely careful and to take things extremely slowly.
I’m not saying she shouldn’t be with him (I’m not that much of a hypocrite), just not talking marriage just yet.
totally agree with you here, and after 4 months shes already prepared to meet him and possible marrage, crazy
 
Posted by slewth (Member # 16166) on :
 
Look..give the poor girl a break...she just wanted to know about about egyptian culture/life, NOT to be lectured. If she chooses to get married, well so be it.
Her choice, her life-journey.
I agree with most of you about education/college and maturity first, but it's not our choice.
Don't badger the poor kid!
 
Posted by Shisha-Master (Member # 14189) on :
 
*sheds a tear*
 
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 
lets hope the mother has some smarts. [Roll Eyes]
 
Posted by Lady Ferret (Member # 15263) on :
 
Whatever she decides she will be wrong and criticised over it. There are some odd people flying around!

Vader, did you get smoke in your eye again!
 
Posted by MoDeStY (Member # 5554) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by LovedOne:
Yes, I saw that thread and gave her the information she needed. If I knew at the time that she was only 17 and knew seemingly nothing about Muslims as she has so obviously pointed out in this thread, though she says she is Muslim, I might have thought twice about facilitating what could be a very big problem.

I am married to a Muslim man and I am Muslim myself, I am not picking on her about being Muslim, but she is seemingly ignorant about alot of issues and even basic facts, and going into a marriage this way is just asking for alot of trouble. She has known this man for only 4 months, and only online, she has never met him in person. Ask her how long she has been Muslim.

I am not wishing her any harm, but it seems that both you and the original poster need to open your eyes.

** I was only asking about how long she had been Muslim, because she is fairly ignorant about some things. I could personally care less how long she has been Muslim. I just think knowing how long she's been Muslim might explain a few things.
It dose not matter how long she has been a Muslim, I have seen Muslims with Muslim parents that are more ignorant about basic things like tahara, salah, can i have sex before marriage sheikh is having a boyfriend halaal sheikh kind of Muslims.. And I have seen new Muslims that knows more about fiqh.. It really depend on how seriously you wish to know your religion, and how much you wish to adhere the Quran and Sunnah..

Allah tells us in the Quran al Kareem

quote:
[For Allah loves those who turn to Him constantly and He loves those who keep themselves pure and clean] (Al-Baqarah 2:222)
quote:
most honorable of you in the sight of Allah is the most advanced of you in Taqwa (piety) (Al-Hujurat: 13).
It dose not say about how long you have been a muslim..
 
Posted by MoDeStY (Member # 5554) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Pillar:
quote:
Originally posted by weirdkitty:
Thing is, she will probably go to Egypt, stay in a nice hotel, have some romantic dinners with her guy, where he whispers sweet nothings, and then will come home all loved up thinking she is ready to marry.

I have been five times now, and every time I go it is like another piece of the puzzle. But despite staying with him in a flat, to really get to see what married life and living in Egypt would be like, the puzzle isn't even a quarter finished.
This time I went for nearly a month, and comparing that to when I was there in a hotel, boy, it could have been a totally new world, it is so different. Going there for six months, a year, etc, will also give me a totally different picture. Not just on the culture, but on the guy too.
MSN conversations wont even give you 1% of who he really is, and nor will just romantic dinners, and a sweet goodbye at the hotel door. You have a long way to go before marriage should even enter your head.
With respect kitty, what you are talking about doesnt exactly fit with how 'muslims' do things, and she is a muslim. She would be getting married before living with him, thats the point.

Of course she isn't going to know everything about him, but i disagree that speaking to him only tells her 1%... Of course it tells her more than that.

You will constantly learn about your partner, once married, once you live together, have kids, hit problems, etc etc. There is no way on this earth that you can know someone 100% UNTIL you live together daily as man and wife (or co-habit, if thats your thing)

In addition, not everyone can afford to travel to egypt 5 times a year, or to stay for 4 weeks at a time. Most people have work or family commitments that prevent this.

I agree with you that spending as much time with the person prior to marriage is the most sensible thing to do. I also agree that romantic dinners and staying in nice hotels is not reality, but be careful you dont turn into one of the ES cynics [Wink]


I can understand why people would jump down this poor girls throat because she asked whether Egyptian men were clean, but please give her a break.

She is 17, she is still young and how does she know? She doesnt want to offend him so she asks here, where's the crime?
Most egyptians consider western people pretty stinky due to personal habits, such as using toilet paper rather than water!

And where did she ask advice about whether she SHOULD get married or not? Everyone is quick to jump on top of her telling her she cant possibly know him well enough...how do you know?

Her own MOTHER is going with her to check him out and see if he is a nice guy etc etc, where is the harm in that?

It makes me laugh how people can judge a woman who wants to get married as 'rushing into things' but not a woman who dates a man?! Its almost as if it has become so backward in Some countries that its now more acceptable to have many boyfriends than get married?

I do hope that all those who are saying she is 'rushing into things' have not had sex with their boyfriends for at least the first 4 months, or however long you are suggesting she 'wait' - otherwise that might just be a tad hypocrytical...its like saying your body is worth less than marriage and its ok to date and have sex, as long as you dont get married??

Furthermore, the comment on muslims being 'clean' due to them washing 5 times a day is untrue. Muslims SHOULD be clean, but many are not, so as someone else said, its down to personal hygiene habits and one persons idea of clean might differ to someone elses.

I am glad your mum is going with you Roqayya and I hope you have a nice time [Smile]
Basically its like saying you are not too young to have sex (since most 17 years old are actually busy having sex with everyone or anyone and which most of the times leads to abortion, I should know as I see them in my daily job) but you are too young for marriage and some responsibilities.. Lord Have mercy..
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by MoDeStY:
[QUOTE]It dose not matter how long she has been a Muslim, I have seen Muslims with Muslim parents that are more ignorant about basic things like tahara, salah, can i have sex before marriage sheikh is having a boyfriend halaal sheikh kind of Muslims.. And I have seen new Muslims that knows more about fiqh.. It really depend on how seriously you wish to know your religion..
It has nothing at all to do with religion or how long she has been Muslim. The question she asked was a question about culture, which we all know is not entirely related to religion. Even if she was an expert in Islam and could recite the Quran frontwards and backwards, she has no way of really understanding the culture of Egypt without actually having been there. We already established the fact that there are very few resources on the internet and in books that deal with this actual subject. The best way for her to gain the necessary understanding is to actually talk to people and ask them or see the country with her own eyes. This was exactly what she did and she is simply trying to prepare herself to come here. These are simple steps that anyone moving to another country would take.

Keep in mind this girl is young and is living in the US. Americans (and I can say this because I am one) are pretty ignorant as a whole about what is going on in the rest of the world outside of their own backyards. Many Americans view Middle Eastern countries as an entirely different planet and tend to group Egypt in with the likes of Iraq and Saudi Arabia, assuming they are all the same. Before I moved to Egypt I had people saying things to me like "Why do you want to live in a tent and ride a camel?" "Why would you want to live in Egypt - you will have to walk 10 feet behind the men and cover your face?" And these comments were coming from seemingly educated people. They just don't know any better and there are alot of myths that they easily believe.

Furthermore, this girl is obviously a convert to Islam. Converts to Islam in the US (especially young, unmarried women) tend to attract lots of religious fanatics and often become them themselves. Still this does not mean she gains instant knowledge about the "CULTURE".

Even if she goes down to her local mosque and chats up some Egyptians, Pakistanis, Indians, Saudis etc. she still will not get an accurate picture of cultural aspects of life in these countries. People tend to sugar coat information about their home countries because they want us to like them and not be afraid of them. Islamophobia is a problem in the US to some degree. When Americans convert to Islam as they are doing in record numbers, especially young girls like this, Muslims are happy and don't want to say anything to give a bad impression.

I should know - it happened to me. I had an Egyptian in the US tell me that everyone in Egypt remains a virgin until marriage. When I got here I found out otherwise.
 
Posted by Mimmi (Member # 3606) on :
 
Where does she say that she is a Muslim????
 
Posted by MoDeStY (Member # 5554) on :
 
>>>>Here<<<<
 
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
 
My goodness you people can get an awful lot of mileage out of one simple question. I never thought I would say this but thank goodness for people like MD that can just give a straight answer. Do You really think this girl is still reading?
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Penny:
My goodness you people can get an awful lot of mileage out of one simple question. I never thought I would say this but thank goodness for people like MD that can just give a straight answer. Do You really think this girl is still reading?
If you think MD is giving straight answers then let's hope she's not still reading. I don't think she will ever post anything here again.
 
Posted by Tansy (Member # 15976) on :
 
I can't say about Islamic men, but my ex was a tart. I am freak as seen by my freinds as I clean my self allot, I see nothing wrong with it.
 
Posted by Shisha-Master (Member # 14189) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Ferret:


Vader, did you get smoke in your eye again!
Nah, it was just so romantic from slewth. I think we should leave them alone now. [Razz]
 
Posted by roqayya (Member # 16255) on :
 
So, I visited Egypt. And guess what? My egyptian man is sooooo clean! Cleaner than me even! Crazy eygptian men - I love 'em!
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
So, I visited Egypt. And guess what? My egyptian man is sooooo clean! Cleaner than me even! Crazy eygptian men - I love 'em!
What's crazy about Egyptian men [Confused] And what about Egypt? Did you find it to be clean? [Eek!]
 
Posted by roqayya (Member # 16255) on :
 
No, egypt was not very clean, but I loved the dirtiness of it! The Egyptians were so friendly and I feel so welcomed and comfortable there.
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
No, egypt was not very clean, but I loved the dirtiness of it! The Egyptians were so friendly and I feel so welcomed and comfortable there.
Yes, Egyptians are friendly welcoming people. But that comfortable feeling of being surrounded by dirtiness wears off after a while. Just wait until you enter the full blown culture shock phase.
 
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
No, egypt was not very clean, but I loved the dirtiness of it! The Egyptians were so friendly and I feel so welcomed and comfortable there.
Yes, Egyptians are friendly welcoming people. But that comfortable feeling of being surrounded by dirtiness wears off after a while. Just wait until you enter the full blown culture shock phase.
yes, when nothing gets done and nothing, i mean absolutely NOTHING is easy as it is back home, suppliers dont really want to sell anything, workers dont actually want to work, you cant find where to buy a cup hook for 4 months, light bulbs work for 2 mins and water heaters for 24 hours which takes a week to put right, blah blah, I love it here!!! [Big Grin]
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
No, egypt was not very clean, but I loved the dirtiness of it! The Egyptians were so friendly and I feel so welcomed and comfortable there.
Yes, Egyptians are friendly welcoming people. But that comfortable feeling of being surrounded by dirtiness wears off after a while. Just wait until you enter the full blown culture shock phase.
yes, when nothing gets done and nothing, i mean absolutely NOTHING is easy as it is back home, suppliers dont really want to sell anything, workers dont actually want to work, you cant find where to buy a cup hook for 4 months, light bulbs work for 2 mins and water heaters for 24 hours which takes a week to put right, blah blah, I love it here!!! [Big Grin]
@Ayisha: Don't exaggerate. The light bulps (bulbs) work for at least 5 minutes. [Smile]
 
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
No, egypt was not very clean, but I loved the dirtiness of it! The Egyptians were so friendly and I feel so welcomed and comfortable there.
Yes, Egyptians are friendly welcoming people. But that comfortable feeling of being surrounded by dirtiness wears off after a while. Just wait until you enter the full blown culture shock phase.
yes, when nothing gets done and nothing, i mean absolutely NOTHING is easy as it is back home, suppliers dont really want to sell anything, workers dont actually want to work, you cant find where to buy a cup hook for 4 months, light bulbs work for 2 mins and water heaters for 24 hours which takes a week to put right, blah blah, I love it here!!! [Big Grin]
@Ayisha: Don't exaggerate. The light bulps (bulbs) work for at least 5 minutes. [Smile]
Ahhhh but that assumes they have not cut through your electricity cables for the 5th time that week and you have actually got any power, and even Egyptian men can't stay clean when the water is cut off for the umpteenth time, and when the water is cut off then just wait to see what sort of smells start eminating from the drains...I knew there was one good reason to live 8 floors up without a lift!
 
Posted by The Ministry of Common Sense (Member # 15597) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Penny:
Ahhhh but that assumes they have not cut through your electricity cables for the 5th time that week and you have actually got any power, and even Egyptian men can't stay clean when the water is cut off for the umpteenth time, and when the water is cut off then just wait to see what sort of smells start eminating from the drains...I knew there was one good reason to live 8 floors up without a lift!
And when your drain clogs up...good luck trying to find a bottle of drain opener.
 
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Penny:
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:
Originally posted by The Ministry of Common Sense:
quote:
Originally posted by roqayya:
No, egypt was not very clean, but I loved the dirtiness of it! The Egyptians were so friendly and I feel so welcomed and comfortable there.
Yes, Egyptians are friendly welcoming people. But that comfortable feeling of being surrounded by dirtiness wears off after a while. Just wait until you enter the full blown culture shock phase.
yes, when nothing gets done and nothing, i mean absolutely NOTHING is easy as it is back home, suppliers dont really want to sell anything, workers dont actually want to work, you cant find where to buy a cup hook for 4 months, light bulbs work for 2 mins and water heaters for 24 hours which takes a week to put right, blah blah, I love it here!!! [Big Grin]
@Ayisha: Don't exaggerate. The light bulps (bulbs) work for at least 5 minutes. [Smile]
Ahhhh but that assumes they have not cut through your electricity cables for the 5th time that week and you have actually got any power, and even Egyptian men can't stay clean when the water is cut off for the umpteenth time, and when the water is cut off then just wait to see what sort of smells start eminating from the drains...I knew there was one good reason to live 8 floors up without a lift!
thats why you're so fit Penny [Big Grin] [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Dubai Girl (Member # 15488) on :
 
Wow Penny I can't believe you live on the 8th floor....my boyfriends parents live on the 5th floor and their building has no lift either....I'm normally gasping for air as I'm not used to stairs anymore. My apartment is on the 17th floor...so i only ever take the lift.

I bet you have to check 10 times that you've got everything before you head outside....:-)
 


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