posted
"it's just a minority" "we don't even have the ressources to produce it" "it's all in the hands of the white devils" "it will certainly never become mainstream"
Reality:
New movie "The Book of Clarence" starring black ancient palestinians with of course a black jesus :
Tazarah
Why are you stalking my social media?
Member # 23365
posted
Europeans been doing this for decades (without any historical basis) and now you're triggered about a movie with an accurate depiction starring people who have the proper skin color.
Cry
Posts: 2493 | From: North America | Registered: Mar 2021
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quote:Originally posted by Antalas: "it's just a minority" "we don't even have the ressources to produce it" "it's all in the hands of the white devils" "it will certainly never become mainstream"
Reality:
New movie "The Book of Clarence" starring black ancient palestinians with of course a black jesus :
A faith based movie with an all black cast doesn't reflect any mainstream ideology. It's as culturally relevant as the passion. Judge em equally.
Posts: 1781 | From: New York | Registered: Jul 2016
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quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: A faith based movie with an all black cast doesn't reflect any mainstream ideology. It's as culturally relevant as the passion. Judge em equally. [/QB]
Certainly, this is a widely accepted ideology within the Afro-American community. The majority of Afro-Americans wouldn't find this offensive; in fact, they would strongly support it, and you know it.
Regardless of its cultural relevance, "The Passion" achieved worldwide success and left a deep impression on Christian communities across the globe. As I mentioned before, over time, there will be an increasing presence of "blackcentric" movies in the West. This is just the initial stage of that trend.
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
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posted
Yes, Black people who pray to Jesus would very much like to believe he's black. That isn't appropriation as much as it is propaganda. There should be black centric movies where there are black people. Just like there are white centric movies where there are whites and Arab centric movies where there are Arabs, And Indocentric movies where there are indians and East Asiocentric movies where there are East Asians. all of these groups can and or have already made their depictins of historical and mythical figures of their own liking. The key word is that this is faith-based. The religion is strengthened by such portrayals by any community.
You've been complaining about blackwashing over and over again as it pertains to mainstream Ideals and cultural consciousness. It'll likely never get to a point where black-washing achieves what you're implying in our lifetimes. It's still hard to get people to believe that certain people who were visibly black were black, despite it being suggested by their artwork, contemporaneous representation in other's artwork, historical descriptions and attestations and even genes.
Complaining about this is just lazy.
Posts: 1781 | From: New York | Registered: Jul 2016
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posted
Maybe the problem is the lazyness of certain film makers who feel that they must race swap historical figures and replace them with "black" (or "white") actors, instead of finding actors who belong to the same ethnicity as the main figures in the film (or at least look like that ethnicity). When it concerns historical films it could be appropriate to make the effort of finding ethnically representative actors.
Concerning Biblical films, film makers mostly continue an old tradition of depicting Biblical figures as belonging to the artists own ethnicity.
But overall it seems that few North African or Middle Eastern historical (or alleged historical) figures in Hollywoods films are depicted by North African or Middle Eastern actors (even if there are exceptions like Rami Malek, who is an Egyptian, who played an Egyptian Pharaoh in Night at the Museum).
-------------------- Once an archaeologist, always an archaeologist Posts: 2684 | From: Sweden | Registered: Mar 2020
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quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: [QB] Yes, Black people who pray to Jesus would very much like to believe he's black. That isn't appropriation as much as it is propaganda. There should be black centric movies where there are black people. Just like there are white centric movies where there are whites and Arab centric movies where there are Arabs, And Indocentric movies where there are indians and East Asiocentric movies where there are East Asians. all of these groups can and or have already made their depictins of historical and mythical figures of their own liking. The key word is that this is faith-based. The religion is strengthened by such portrayals by any community.
I disagree. There shouldn't be any -centric movies in ethnically diverse countries like the US. The optimal approach would involve casting actors who closely resemble the ancient people being portrayed, devoid of any ideological or political biases. If the storyline is set in a science fiction realm, then embracing diversity is acceptable. However, tampering with historical events is a contentious matter that should be handled with care, given its sensitivity. Whether rooted in faith or not, such initiatives can deeply alienate individuals whose ancestors are being depicted. Additionally, there's a risk that viewers might be led to believe that these depictions are a truer reflection of reality, potentially fostering misconceptions that for instance historians were merely promoting "white supremacy" by concealing the actual facts.
quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: You've been complaining about blackwashing over and over again as it pertains to mainstream Ideals and cultural consciousness. It'll likely never get to a point where black-washing achieves what you're implying in our lifetimes. It's still hard to get people to believe that certain people who were visibly black were black, despite it being suggested by their artwork, contemporaneous representation in other's artwork, historical descriptions and attestations and even genes.
Complaining about this is just lazy.
The trend has already begun, and I can provide you with numerous other examples that are even more extreme (like an all black cast with evil characters being exclusively played by european actors). I won't delve into the specifics as I've addressed this matter previously, but it's evident that in Western societies, black individuals are increasingly becoming one of the most privileged minority groups, often overshadowing other minorities that, in many instances, surpass blacks in numbers. Inclusion efforts seem to be disproportionately focused on the black community. Hispanic, East Asian, or South Asian children are growing up having to grapple with this reality and accept their lack of representation. I won't even touch upon the even more pronounced case of North Africans in Europe.
Also who are the ancient people you're referring to ? (I know you won't answer this lol) It appears that you're amplifying the situation based on niche online communities.
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
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posted
what about movies about Jesus and the people of Nazareth acted by Western Europeans?
Posts: 42920 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: what about movies about Jesus and the people of Nazareth acted by Western Europeans?
Depends on the casting, but generally, many Europeans can convincingly resemble individuals from the Levant. The distinction is noticeably less pronounced compared to the difference between levantines and Afro-Americans of West African heritage.
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Tazarah
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posted
According to Dr. Rebecca Futo Kennedy, ancient north africans were "subsaharan africans". She also says Herodotus wrote that the "Ethiopians" were indigenous to north africa.
She also goes into detail about how north africa, egypt and the middle east were all whitewashed.
Classical historians were known to write about "Ethiopians" inhabiting the ancient Levant as well.
quote:Originally posted by Antalas: "it's just a minority" "we don't even have the ressources to produce it" "it's all in the hands of the white devils" "it will certainly never become mainstream"
Reality:
New movie "The Book of Clarence" starring black ancient palestinians with of course a black jesus :
Do you even bother to read the bible? Black people are all in the Old Testament. Black Judeans etc. Black Arabs.
There were black Palestinians all over southern Judah, Negev, Lacish.
Like this is tedious if you are going to comment without bothering to STUDY!
Like legit, this is a subject that requires extensive reading and understanding. so not matter what BS you put up here I will not be commenting any further because it's a waste of time.
-------------------- It's not my burden to disabuse the ignorant of their wrong opinions Posts: 2699 | From: New York | Registered: Jun 2015
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quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: what about movies about Jesus and the people of Nazareth acted by Western Europeans?
Depends on the casting, but generally, many Europeans can convincingly resemble individuals from the Levant. The distinction is noticeably less pronounced compared to the difference between levantines and Afro-Americans of West African heritage.
There were African/Kushites/Egyptians/Nabateans in the Levant
-------------------- It's not my burden to disabuse the ignorant of their wrong opinions Posts: 2699 | From: New York | Registered: Jun 2015
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posted
This has NOTHING to do with Afrocentrism and you don't know anything about what the majority of Afro-Americans think
Posts: 2595 | From: Vicksburg | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
Anyway, it looks like a great movie. I can't wait to see it.
-------------------- It's not my burden to disabuse the ignorant of their wrong opinions Posts: 2699 | From: New York | Registered: Jun 2015
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Tazarah
Why are you stalking my social media?
Member # 23365
posted
@Antalas
Genetics, shmenetics. Your kind always runs to faulty "genetics" when the historical accounts and archaeology slap you in the face. There is no ancient Israelite DNA on record.
"The most common analytical method within population genetics is deeply flawed, according to a new study from Lund University in Sweden. This may have led to incorrect results and misconceptions about ethnicity and genetic relationships. The method has been used in hundreds of thousands of studies, affecting results within medical genetics and even commercial ancestry tests. The study is published in Scientific Reports."
"The most common analytical method within population genetics is deeply flawed, according to a new study from Lund University in Sweden. This may have led to incorrect results and misconceptions about ethnicity and genetic relationships. The method has been used in hundreds of thousands of studies, affecting results within medical genetics and even commercial ancestry tests. The study is published in Scientific Reports.
The rate at which scientific data can be collected is rising exponentially, leading to massive and highly complex datasets, dubbed the "Big Data revolution." To make these data more manageable, researchers use statistical methods that aim to compact and simplify the data while still retaining most of the key information. Perhaps the most widely used method is called PCA (principal component analysis). By analogy, think of PCA as an oven with flour, sugar and eggs as the data input. The oven may always do the same thing, but the outcome, a cake, critically depends on the ingredients' ratios and how they are combined."
quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: [QB] Yes, Black people who pray to Jesus would very much like to believe he's black. That isn't appropriation as much as it is propaganda. There should be black centric movies where there are black people. Just like there are white centric movies where there are whites and Arab centric movies where there are Arabs, And Indocentric movies where there are indians and East Asiocentric movies where there are East Asians. all of these groups can and or have already made their depictins of historical and mythical figures of their own liking. The key word is that this is faith-based. The religion is strengthened by such portrayals by any community.
I disagree. There shouldn't be any -centric movies in ethnically diverse countries like the US. The optimal approach would involve casting actors who closely resemble the ancient people being portrayed, devoid of any ideological or political biases. If the storyline is set in a science fiction realm, then embracing diversity is acceptable. However, tampering with historical events is a contentious matter that should be handled with care, given its sensitivity. Whether rooted in faith or not, such initiatives can deeply alienate individuals whose ancestors are being depicted. Additionally, there's a risk that viewers might be led to believe that these depictions are a truer reflection of reality, potentially fostering misconceptions that for instance historians were merely promoting "white supremacy" by concealing the actual facts.
quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: You've been complaining about blackwashing over and over again as it pertains to mainstream Ideals and cultural consciousness. It'll likely never get to a point where black-washing achieves what you're implying in our lifetimes. It's still hard to get people to believe that certain people who were visibly black were black, despite it being suggested by their artwork, contemporaneous representation in other's artwork, historical descriptions and attestations and even genes.
Complaining about this is just lazy.
The trend has already begun, and I can provide you with numerous other examples that are even more extreme (like an all black cast with evil characters being exclusively played by european actors). I won't delve into the specifics as I've addressed this matter previously, but it's evident that in Western societies, black individuals are increasingly becoming one of the most privileged minority groups, often overshadowing other minorities that, in many instances, surpass blacks in numbers. Inclusion efforts seem to be disproportionately focused on the black community. Hispanic, East Asian, or South Asian children are growing up having to grapple with this reality and accept their lack of representation. I won't even touch upon the even more pronounced case of North Africans in Europe.
Also who are the ancient people you're referring to ? (I know you won't answer this lol) It appears that you're amplifying the situation based on niche online communities.
Ancient Egyptians, Numidians and attestations of Jesus himself just to list some off the top of my head.
But there's no need to go back and forth, Your response will be predictable and you'll continue to deny that you're merely upset because you're anti-black. You don't even care to look at historical record to tell the phenotype of the people at question. Your comments about the samaritans and European actors shows such.
Hollywood rarely ever do their due diligence in casting based on historical resemblance, This is just the next example. Based on Jesus' biblical description, the majority of the christian world likely got it wrong in their depictions. No one cares.
Posts: 1781 | From: New York | Registered: Jul 2016
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posted
From what I've read online so far, it looks like this Book of Clarence movie will be a comedy. Therefore, they may not be going for historical accuracy with regards to the cast. Personally, I would have preferred Middle Eastern actors to play the ancient Judeans, but considering how many times White people have gotten to play them in the movies, a movie with Black Judeans isn't much more problematic to me.
posted
Man this thread is a joke, the movie is a damn comedy, like you seriously up here whining like a little school girl about the historical accuracy of a movie about a dude named “ Clearance” living in 29 AD. Lol, and people take this dude seriously, like he is a legitimate debater interested in historical science. Lol can’t believe this nucca up here bitching about the accuracy of a god damn comedy movie
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
There have been other movies that depicted a black Jesus before this one so the idea of this being a new trend isn’t really accurate. Most have been comedies, Color of the Cross was one and it was told as historical accuracy.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: A video where (among other things) the film is discussed (at 27:15)
2. As a self-identified Christian, no one even Christians themselves takes the racial depiction of Jesus seriously. If this bothers you Antalas then so should the blonde hair/blue eyed nordic depiction of Jesus also.
3. There’s already a Black comedy TV show called “Black Jesus.” No offense but this thread is more paranoia.
Posts: 1891 | From: NY | Registered: Sep 2014
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quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: Ancient Egyptians, Numidians and attestations of Jesus himself just to list some off the top of my head.
I’m surprised you hold such extreme Afrocentric opinions. It seems that my initial judgement was correct, and you are just another Afrocentrist with simply experience in Bioinformatics. At this point it's truly pathological I don't even know what to say.
quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: But there's no need to go back and forth, Your response will be predictable and you'll continue to deny that you're merely upset because you're anti-black. You don't even care to look at historical record to tell the phenotype of the people at question. Your comments about the samaritans and European actors shows such.
Hollywood rarely ever do their due diligence in casting based on historical resemblance, This is just the next example. Based on Jesus' biblical description, the majority of the christian world likely got it wrong in their depictions. No one cares.
I have yet to see any concrete evidence from you that I am "anti-black" (don't start with posts on ABF that I made when I was a teenager). It seems like anyone who disagrees with your point of view is labeled as "emotional", "upset", or "unable to stand blackness". My issue is not with skin color or ethnicity, which are trivial aspects to me. Rather, my problem is with people who disrespect my people and ancestors and who appropriate our history and culture.
Furthermore, historical records do not support your point of view, as I have demonstrated multiple times. A recent example was the "Leucosyrians" brought by Djehuti which he tried to interpret literally, implying that if there are "white Syrians", then logically the rest must be "black". However, I showed that this denomination had nothing to do with skin color but was instead linked to geography (Leuco being associated with the North as those Leucosyrians lived north of Syria in Cappadocia). Unfortunately, Djehuti could not answer as usual, and there are many other examples like this that you avoid. I have also repeatedly told you that you clearly lack a deep understanding and knowledge of such topics. While you may be good in bioinformatics, when it comes to history, you are clearly out of your element. You interpret everything literally, project American identities onto ancient people, and are unable to differentiate ethnonyms from geographic labels.
Lastly, nobody said that Hollywood always casted the best actors for these kind of roles. However, it is not much of a problem when the differences between the two populations are not stark and it is also rarely politically motivated. I would not be bothered if ancient North Africans were played by Latinos or Middle Easterners.
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
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posted
@Askia Fair enough, I didn’t know it was a comedy. However, many Afro-Americans believe that this is an accurate depiction of ancient Israelites, and you know it (just check the comment section lol). Therefore, it would be disingenuous to pretend otherwise.
Also who said I wasn't bothered by a nordic depiction of Jesus ? It's as bad as the black one.
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
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quote:Originally posted by Antalas: @Askia Fair enough, I didn’t know it was a comedy. However, many Afro-Americans believe that this is an accurate depiction of ancient Israelites, and you know it (just check the comment section lol). Therefore, it would be disingenuous to pretend otherwise.
Also who said I wasn't bothered by a nordic depiction of Jesus ? It's as bad as the black one.
how do we know what ancient Israelites looked like?
Posts: 42920 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Antalas: @Askia Fair enough, I didn’t know it was a comedy. However, many Afro-Americans believe that this is an accurate depiction of ancient Israelites, and you know it (just check the comment section lol). Therefore, it would be disingenuous to pretend otherwise.
Also who said I wasn't bothered by a nordic depiction of Jesus ? It's as bad as the black one.
Stop speaking on what Afro Americans think when you don't live around any of us nor know any, your anti-black bullshit is pathetic and annoying.
Posts: 2595 | From: Vicksburg | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
^^^^Years ago I posted images of Christ and Disciples from the Xtian Catacombs of Domitilla which SOME/A FEW had dark skinned depictions, Does this mean Christ was black no, but that there were probably converts who had similar features in the early Xtian communties.
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Tazarah
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posted
It's a historically recorded fact that the first images of Christ depicted him as a black man.
"Liberal Review: An Organ of the Independent Thinkers of America, Volume 3" by Mangasar Mugurditch Mangasarian, page 478 (1906) Library of the University of Michigan
Tazarah
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Member # 23365
posted
Furthermore, none of the 2 black men in the OP photo posted by Antalas are supposed to be Jesus. Antalas has no idea what he is talking about as usual. If you watch the trailer, they do show Jesus but they do not show his face. Just his silhouette.
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quote:Originally posted by Tazarah: According to Dr. Rebecca Futo Kennedy, ancient north africans were "subsaharan africans". She also says Herodotus wrote that the "Ethiopians" were indigenous to north africa.
She also goes into detail about how north africa, egypt and the middle east were all whitewashed.
Classical historians were known to write about "Ethiopians" inhabiting the ancient Levant as well.
Dr. Kennedy's assessment is correct. According to Classical Greek tradition, Thalassa (the Mediterranean Sea) was the central region of the world that divided the northern nations from the southern nations. The latter were described as dark/black skinned and this was explained by the myth of Phaethon nearly crashing the chariot of the sun to earth in the southern lands which created the deserts (the Sahara of Africa, the Syrian and Arabian of Southwest Asia, and the Thar of India) and burnt the skins of the inhabitants black. So the identification of "black" with "Sub-Sahara" is an oxymoron to the Greeks and Romans. The first reference to "Ethiopia" by the Greeks was the nation ruled by Cepheus and Cassiopia and their daughter Princess Andromeda rescued by Perseus and made his wife. Yet their capital city by the coast Joppa is identified with modern Yaffa.
And yes there were even black peoples present in the Levant as well. Here's another example in this reconstructed scene of Canaanites paying tribute to Tutankhamun.
Even Hebrew sources from both the Bible and extra-Biblical traditions like the Mishnah and Talmud claim that 'Kushi' (blacks) were natives of the southern Levant especially in areas of the Negev Desert and around Edom and the Sinai. And of course we know about the epipaleolithic Natufians being of African extraction so I don't know why it's so surprising to some.
As to the portrayal of Jesus and other Biblical figures as black men, if they could be portrayed as white European types for centuries and that's not a problem then what's the issue with black portrayals? What's good for the goose...
-------------------- Mahirap gisingin ang nagtutulog-tulugan. Posts: 26239 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Seems many peoples who have worshipped Jesus imagined him as looking just like them, and many probably do so still today. Here are four examples
A-West European Jesus B =Ethiopian Jesus C=Chinese Jesus D=Old Swedish Jesus (from the province of Dalarna)
There is no authentic portrait of Jesus, but there are pictures of other people living in the Levant around his time or shortly after.
There are also some facial reconstructions based on skulls from around his time.
-------------------- Once an archaeologist, always an archaeologist Posts: 2684 | From: Sweden | Registered: Mar 2020
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Tazarah
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posted
^ false. It's historically recorded that the first pictures of Jesus depicted him as a black man. I've already shared the source.
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posted
Antalas simply likes trolling Afro Americans with anti black vitrol, this topic itself was trolling with its "Afrocentrism strikes again" title.
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti:
quote:Originally posted by Tazarah: According to Dr. Rebecca Futo Kennedy, ancient north africans were "subsaharan africans". She also says Herodotus wrote that the "Ethiopians" were indigenous to north africa.
She also goes into detail about how north africa, egypt and the middle east were all whitewashed.
Classical historians were known to write about "Ethiopians" inhabiting the ancient Levant as well.
Dr. Kennedy's assessment is correct. According to Classical Greek tradition, Thalassa (the Mediterranean Sea) was the central region of the world that divided the northern nations from the southern nations. The latter were described as dark/black skinned and this was explained by the myth of Phaethon nearly crashing the chariot of the sun to earth in the southern lands which created the deserts (the Sahara of Africa, the Syrian and Arabian of Southwest Asia, and the Thar of India) and burnt the skins of the inhabitants black. So the identification of "black" with "Sub-Sahara" is an oxymoron to the Greeks and Romans. The first reference to "Ethiopia" by the Greeks was the nation ruled by Cepheus and Cassiopia and their daughter Princess Andromeda rescued by Perseus and made his wife. Yet their capital city by the coast Joppa is identified with modern Yaffa.
And yes there were even black peoples present in the Levant as well. Here's another example in this reconstructed scene of Canaanites paying tribute to Tutankhamun.
Even Hebrew sources from both the Bible and extra-Biblical traditions like the Mishnah and Talmud claim that 'Kushi' (blacks) were natives of the southern Levant especially in areas of the Negev Desert and around Edom and the Sinai. And of course we know about the epipaleolithic Natufians being of African extraction so I don't know why it's so surprising to some.
As to the portrayal of Jesus and other Biblical figures as black men, if they could be portrayed as white European types for centuries and that's not a problem then what's the issue with black portrayals? What's good for the goose...
Tazarah
Why are you stalking my social media?
Member # 23365
posted
Eyewitness account from the 19th century that recorded native Palestinians and Jews as resembling southern black slaves in america. So much so, that one of them refused to come to america because he feared being sold into slavery.
"Memorials of Gilbert Haven, Bishop of the Methodist Episcopal Church" page 340 (1880) University of Michigan
quote:Originally posted by Tazarah: ^ false. It's historically recorded that the first pictures of Jesus depicted him as a black man. I've already shared the source.
That is not the point, the point is that many through times have imagined Jesus in different ways, and do it still today. Most people in the world did never come to Israel, and most people out in the world have still not been there, so they would of course model Jesus after people who surrounded them.
-------------------- Once an archaeologist, always an archaeologist Posts: 2684 | From: Sweden | Registered: Mar 2020
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Tazarah
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posted
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti:
quote:Originally posted by Tazarah: According to Dr. Rebecca Futo Kennedy, ancient north africans were "subsaharan africans". She also says Herodotus wrote that the "Ethiopians" were indigenous to north africa.
She also goes into detail about how north africa, egypt and the middle east were all whitewashed.
Classical historians were known to write about "Ethiopians" inhabiting the ancient Levant as well.
Dr. Kennedy's assessment is correct. According to Classical Greek tradition, Thalassa (the Mediterranean Sea) was the central region of the world that divided the northern nations from the southern nations. The latter were described as dark/black skinned and this was explained by the myth of Phaethon nearly crashing the chariot of the sun to earth in the southern lands which created the deserts (the Sahara of Africa, the Syrian and Arabian of Southwest Asia, and the Thar of India) and burnt the skins of the inhabitants black. So the identification of "black" with "Sub-Sahara" is an oxymoron to the Greeks and Romans. The first reference to "Ethiopia" by the Greeks was the nation ruled by Cepheus and Cassiopia and their daughter Princess Andromeda rescued by Perseus and made his wife. Yet their capital city by the coast Joppa is identified with modern Yaffa.
And yes there were even black peoples present in the Levant as well. Here's another example in this reconstructed scene of Canaanites paying tribute to Tutankhamun.
Even Hebrew sources from both the Bible and extra-Biblical traditions like the Mishnah and Talmud claim that 'Kushi' (blacks) were natives of the southern Levant especially in areas of the Negev Desert and around Edom and the Sinai. And of course we know about the epipaleolithic Natufians being of African extraction so I don't know why it's so surprising to some.
As to the portrayal of Jesus and other Biblical figures as black men, if they could be portrayed as white European types for centuries and that's not a problem then what's the issue with black portrayals? What's good for the goose...
Thank you for this valuable information.
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Tazarah
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quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx:
quote:Originally posted by Tazarah: ^ false. It's historically recorded that the first pictures of Jesus depicted him as a black man. I've already shared the source.
That is not the point, the point is that many through times have imagined Jesus in different ways, and do it still today. Most people in the world did never come to Israel, and most people out in the world have still not been there, so they would of course model Jesus after people who surrounded them.
I see what you are saying, but we have historical records that say the first images of Christ depicted him as a black man. And a lot of these images were found in Rome, where Christ himself walked, and where plenty of people saw him and knew what he looked like.
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posted
^^^You're ignoring the act that many of the earliest images(from the xtian catacombs) also depict Christ as white,like I said yes, some are dark skinned, but they are not common, at least in my research.
Back in the day there were good websites which had all the Catacomb murals...now its hard to find many in one place..
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Tazarah
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posted
@-Just Call Me Jari-
A lot, if not all of the catacomb images are severely faded. And on top of that, authorities who have actually studied this topic explicitly state that the very first images of Christ portray him as a black man. I'm sure they were well aware of the catacomb imagery when they came to this conclusion.
Posts: 2493 | From: North America | Registered: Mar 2021
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quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Seems many peoples who have worshipped Jesus imagined him as looking just like them, and many probably do so still today. Here are four examples
A-West European Jesus B =Ethiopian Jesus C=Chinese Jesus D=Old Swedish Jesus (from the province of Dalarna)
There is no authentic portrait of Jesus, but there are pictures of other people living in the Levant around his time or shortly after.
There are also some facial reconstructions based on skulls from around his time.
Exactly but that Elijah compares this to historical revisionism...
Moreover ethiopians aren't into those racial debates they can see beyond skin color :
I remember watching a documentary about christian ethiopians then you had the comment section filled with afro-americans complaining that ethiopians had white skinned icons.
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
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quote:Originally posted by Antalas: Afrocentrism strikes again
I don't think the thread title reflects where this movie is coming from
At first glance I would say it was inspired by Black Hebrew Israelite ideology and these groups are no friends with Afrocentrics who usually put Egypt as the original and the biblical as a derivative somewhat copying Egyptian religion
But I'm reading this interview with Jeymes Samuel, the writer and director of the Book of Clarence and I'm not getting a vibe that he was inspired by Black Hebrew Israelite groups either. But I'm sure Jeymes Samuel, Jay Z and others involved in this movie are aware of how this movie overlaps in subject with the 'Hebrews to Negroes" movie and the Kyrie Irving controversy.
But if you read this interview, Jeymes Samuel seems to be a less serious mode and the film is a comedy "a fun-filled extravaganza" he calls it
After Jeymes Samuel Brought Diversity To The Western, He & LaKeith Stanfield Ready To Take On The Bible With ‘The Book Of Clarence’ — Cannes Disruptors
By Mike Fleming DEADLINE
Jeymes Samuel my next movie is The Book of Clarence. And LaKeith Stanfield will play Clarence. And I’m taking it all the way back to the Bible era. You remember those biblical epics, whether they were about the Bible or just taking place around it, from The Ten Commandments to The Greatest Story Ever Told, Samson and Delilah and Ben-Hur, which runs alongside all that stuff in the Bible? As will be The Book of Clarence, a full fun-filled extravaganza. It’s written and ready to go, and set in 29 AD.
I want to tell the tales that we’ve never had before. We’ve never had Black people in the Bible days of cinema. There’s not even a template for us to go, “Well, like that movie?” We’d seen a Black cowboy before. We’ve never seen… Even when Andrew Lloyd Webber made something as nuanced as Jesus Christ Superstar, there’s no Black people in it, except Judas. Judas was the Black guy. “I’m going to betray you, Jesus.” What the hell? That’s what you’re giving us? That’s the Black guy? You saw what I did with the Western. I want to give people something to talk about. Imagine when they unleash Jesus on me. I’m going to give us something we’ve never seen before. But it’s going to be so much fun. We’re deciding now where it will be made, talking to studios. I have a relationship with Netflix. That’s a big thing, but I do need this film to have a viable theatrical component as well.
Yeah. To me, Netflix is like Uber. I didn’t use to call Uber, Uber. I used to call it karma. Because in the U.K., those famous black taxis do not stop for Black people.
That’s why I say Netflix is Uber. They are the out-and-out savior to filmmakers like myself who wanted to get their films done with a high budget and a cast of Black stars.
We have talented execs out there now, and so I think we’re going to see a lot more diverse stories. But we, as Black people, can’t wait for talented execs, or studios to have a guilty conscience. We have to find a way to make what we’re going to make, and nothing can stop us. I think that as soon as we all think like that, we’re not going to be beholden to any temporary waves of guilt. We can just be the change we want to see.
This movie is closer to Black Hebrew Israelite ideology than it is to Afrocentric who are usually Egypt centered but I'm not sure even the Black Hebrew Israelite groups will whole-heartedly support this movie if it also has some irreverent to religion elements
Posts: 42920 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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Exactly but that Elijah compares this to historical revisionism...
Moreover ethiopians aren't into those racial debates they can see beyond skin color :
So you just completely ignored the historical black depictions of Jesus by Ethiopians and that one pic isn't helping your case because there are still some Afro Americans who have white depictions of Jesus on their walls so that likewise invalidates your bullshit claim that all or most Afro Americans have some type of racial agenda.
[img]I remember watching a documentary about christian ethiopians then you had the comment section filled with afro-americans complaining that ethiopians had white skinned icons.
Lies, until you prove most or all Afro Americans have this obsession you need to quit trolling
Posts: 2595 | From: Vicksburg | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
So are you saying AAs don't have depictions of a white Jesus and Ethiopians don't have images of a black Jesus...?
quote:Originally posted by Antalas:
Moreover ethiopians aren't into those racial debates they can see beyond skin color :
I remember watching a documentary about christian ethiopians then you had the comment section filled with afro-americans complaining that ethiopians had white skinned icons. [/QB]
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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So you just completely ignored the historical black depictions of Jesus by Ethiopians and that one pic isn't helping your case because there are still some Afro Americans who have white depictions of Jesus on their walls so that likewise invalidates your bullshit claim that all or most Afro Americans have some type of racial agenda.
Seems like you didn't get the point. Reread my previous post.
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
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