Analysis of Roman grave reveals that York was a multicultural society
Steve Bird Archaeologists have discovered that wealthy black Africans lived in Roman Britain in one of the country’s earliest examples of multiculturalism.
Scientific research techniques have established that a lavish grave containing a woman’s skeleton, an ivory bangle, perfume bottle, mirror and jewellery, belonged to a North African member of York’s high society in the 4th century.
Scientific analysis of isotopes from the teeth revealed that water she drank during her childhood had contained minerals likely to have been found in North Africa. Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race.
Her sarcophagus, which was made of stone, a sign of immense wealth in Roman Britain, was discovered in 1901 in Bootham, York. The city was then a legionary fortress and civilian settlement called Eboracum, founded by the Romans in AD71.
Her well-preserved remains showed that she was 1.5m (5ft 1in) and aged between 18 and 23. There were no signs of a violent death, and muscle markings showed that she had not lived a strenuous life, suggesting that she was affluent. Among the goods found in her grave was a bone with the inscription “Sor ave vivas in Deo” (Hail, sister, may you live in God), suggesting that she may also have been a Christian.
A bracelet of jet, probably from Whitby, North Yorkshire, showed that she had access to local trade networks. Researchers from the University of Reading’s department of archaeology believe that the ivory bangle, an artefact rarely found in Roman Britain, may have been kept by the woman as a memento of home.
Hella Eckardt, who carried out the study, said: “Multicultural Britain is not just a phenomenon of more modern times. Analysis of the ‘Ivory Bangle Lady’ and others like her, contradicts assumptions about the make-up of Roman-British populations as well as the view that African immigrants were of low status, male and likely to have been slaves.”
She said that “Ivory Bangle Lady” was very wealthy — “absolutely from the top end of York society”.
“The link between slavery and Africans is an early modern one. In the Roman world this simply was not the case. Slaves in Roman times could come from any area.”
She added that inscriptions from that period showed that African people were most often members of the imperialist power’s army. But the latest research on a series of skeletons showed that African men had immigrated to Britain, invariably with the Roman Army, and had brought their wives and children.
Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now.
“This skull is particularly interesting, because the stone sarcophagus she was buried in, and the richness of the grave goods, means she was a very wealthy woman.”
The research, A Lady of York; migration, ethnicity and identity in Roman Britain, is published in the March edition of the journal Antiquity. The “Ivory Bangle Lady” will be the centrepiece of an exhibition at the Yorkshire Museum in August entitled Roman York: Meet the People of the Empire.
Posts: 2007 | From: Washington State | Registered: Oct 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: From The Times February 27, 2010
Analysis of Roman grave reveals that York was a multicultural society
Steve Bird Archaeologists have discovered that wealthy black Africans lived in Roman Britain in one of the country’s earliest examples of multiculturalism.
Scientific research techniques have established that a lavish grave containing a woman’s skeleton, an ivory bangle, perfume bottle, mirror and jewellery, belonged to a North African member of York’s high society in the 4th century.
Scientific analysis of isotopes from the teeth revealed that water she drank during her childhood had contained minerals likely to have been found in North Africa. Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race.
Her sarcophagus, which was made of stone, a sign of immense wealth in Roman Britain, was discovered in 1901 in Bootham, York. The city was then a legionary fortress and civilian settlement called Eboracum, founded by the Romans in AD71.
Her well-preserved remains showed that she was 1.5m (5ft 1in) and aged between 18 and 23. There were no signs of a violent death, and muscle markings showed that she had not lived a strenuous life, suggesting that she was affluent. Among the goods found in her grave was a bone with the inscription “Sor ave vivas in Deo” (Hail, sister, may you live in God), suggesting that she may also have been a Christian.
A bracelet of jet, probably from Whitby, North Yorkshire, showed that she had access to local trade networks. Researchers from the University of Reading’s department of archaeology believe that the ivory bangle, an artefact rarely found in Roman Britain, may have been kept by the woman as a memento of home.
Hella Eckardt, who carried out the study, said: “Multicultural Britain is not just a phenomenon of more modern times. Analysis of the ‘Ivory Bangle Lady’ and others like her, contradicts assumptions about the make-up of Roman-British populations as well as the view that African immigrants were of low status, male and likely to have been slaves.”
She said that “Ivory Bangle Lady” was very wealthy — “absolutely from the top end of York society”.
“The link between slavery and Africans is an early modern one. In the Roman world this simply was not the case. Slaves in Roman times could come from any area.”
She added that inscriptions from that period showed that African people were most often members of the imperialist power’s army. But the latest research on a series of skeletons showed that African men had immigrated to Britain, invariably with the Roman Army, and had brought their wives and children.
Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now.
“This skull is particularly interesting, because the stone sarcophagus she was buried in, and the richness of the grave goods, means she was a very wealthy woman.”
The research, A Lady of York; migration, ethnicity and identity in Roman Britain, is published in the March edition of the journal Antiquity. The “Ivory Bangle Lady” will be the centrepiece of an exhibition at the Yorkshire Museum in August entitled Roman York: Meet the People of the Empire.
posted
I once made a post now lost..about the fact that many of the African Roman soldiers especially of high rank if they did not returned to Rome or their countries of origin would have been given lands to settle a few could well intermarry with the local elites..as they would have been comparatively richer..with important connections. That was the basic severance pay package for any Roman soldier..some may not have been X military at all..but long distance traders. Remember this guy was supposed to be the leader of the Theban Legion.who had a falling out with Caesar and loss..but others such as Septimus Servus and Pescennius Niger(The Black) did quite well...well Septimus got rid of him..just maybe some of the BlackMoor's coat of arms reflect those old families as well as Moors of the Islamic era.
Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: From The Times February 27, 2010
Analysis of Roman grave reveals that York was a multicultural society
Steve Bird Archaeologists have discovered that wealthy black Africans lived in Roman Britain in one of the country’s earliest examples of multiculturalism.
Scientific research techniques have established that a lavish grave containing a woman’s skeleton, an ivory bangle, perfume bottle, mirror and jewellery, belonged to a North African member of York’s high society in the 4th century.
Scientific analysis of isotopes from the teeth revealed that water she drank during her childhood had contained minerals likely to have been found in North Africa. Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race.
Her sarcophagus, which was made of stone, a sign of immense wealth in Roman Britain, was discovered in 1901 in Bootham, York. The city was then a legionary fortress and civilian settlement called Eboracum, founded by the Romans in AD71.
Her well-preserved remains showed that she was 1.5m (5ft 1in) and aged between 18 and 23. There were no signs of a violent death, and muscle markings showed that she had not lived a strenuous life, suggesting that she was affluent. Among the goods found in her grave was a bone with the inscription “Sor ave vivas in Deo” (Hail, sister, may you live in God), suggesting that she may also have been a Christian.
A bracelet of jet, probably from Whitby, North Yorkshire, showed that she had access to local trade networks. Researchers from the University of Reading’s department of archaeology believe that the ivory bangle, an artefact rarely found in Roman Britain, may have been kept by the woman as a memento of home.
Hella Eckardt, who carried out the study, said: “Multicultural Britain is not just a phenomenon of more modern times. Analysis of the ‘Ivory Bangle Lady’ and others like her, contradicts assumptions about the make-up of Roman-British populations as well as the view that African immigrants were of low status, male and likely to have been slaves.”
She said that “Ivory Bangle Lady” was very wealthy — “absolutely from the top end of York society”.
“The link between slavery and Africans is an early modern one. In the Roman world this simply was not the case. Slaves in Roman times could come from any area.”
She added that inscriptions from that period showed that African people were most often members of the imperialist power’s army. But the latest research on a series of skeletons showed that African men had immigrated to Britain, invariably with the Roman Army, and had brought their wives and children.
Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now.
“This skull is particularly interesting, because the stone sarcophagus she was buried in, and the richness of the grave goods, means she was a very wealthy woman.”
The research, A Lady of York; migration, ethnicity and identity in Roman Britain, is published in the March edition of the journal Antiquity. The “Ivory Bangle Lady” will be the centrepiece of an exhibition at the Yorkshire Museum in August entitled Roman York: Meet the People of the Empire.
Interesting. You can tell the authors of this article are more in touch with reality when they acknowledge that this woman as a North African was black and not some "caucasian". As some Euronuts fantasize some "caucasian" population native to North Africa whereas blacks are only native to "Sub-Sahara".
Posts: 26238 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now. Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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quote: But the latest research on a series of skeletons showed that African men had immigrated to Britain, invariably with the Roman Army, and had brought their wives and children. Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now
posted
Analysis of Roman grave reveals that York was a multicultural society
Priceless. Rome may even qualify as a "multiracial" society more so than or before Dynastic Egypt does. It is probably only rivaled in this aspect by ancient Greeks.
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: From The Times February 27, 2010
Analysis of Roman grave reveals that York was a multicultural society
Steve Bird Archaeologists have discovered that wealthy black Africans lived in Roman Britain in one of the country’s earliest examples of multiculturalism.
Scientific research techniques have established that a lavish grave containing a woman’s skeleton, an ivory bangle, perfume bottle, mirror and jewellery, belonged to a North African member of York’s high society in the 4th century.
Scientific analysis of isotopes from the teeth revealed that water she drank during her childhood had contained minerals likely to have been found in North Africa. Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race.
Her sarcophagus, which was made of stone, a sign of immense wealth in Roman Britain, was discovered in 1901 in Bootham, York. The city was then a legionary fortress and civilian settlement called Eboracum, founded by the Romans in AD71.
Her well-preserved remains showed that she was 1.5m (5ft 1in) and aged between 18 and 23. There were no signs of a violent death, and muscle markings showed that she had not lived a strenuous life, suggesting that she was affluent. Among the goods found in her grave was a bone with the inscription “Sor ave vivas in Deo” (Hail, sister, may you live in God), suggesting that she may also have been a Christian.
A bracelet of jet, probably from Whitby, North Yorkshire, showed that she had access to local trade networks. Researchers from the University of Reading’s department of archaeology believe that the ivory bangle, an artefact rarely found in Roman Britain, may have been kept by the woman as a memento of home.
Hella Eckardt, who carried out the study, said: “Multicultural Britain is not just a phenomenon of more modern times. Analysis of the ‘Ivory Bangle Lady’ and others like her, contradicts assumptions about the make-up of Roman-British populations as well as the view that African immigrants were of low status, male and likely to have been slaves.”
She said that “Ivory Bangle Lady” was very wealthy — “absolutely from the top end of York society”.
“The link between slavery and Africans is an early modern one. In the Roman world this simply was not the case. Slaves in Roman times could come from any area.”
She added that inscriptions from that period showed that African people were most often members of the imperialist power’s army. But the latest research on a series of skeletons showed that African men had immigrated to Britain, invariably with the Roman Army, and had brought their wives and children.
Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now.
“This skull is particularly interesting, because the stone sarcophagus she was buried in, and the richness of the grave goods, means she was a very wealthy woman.”
The research, A Lady of York; migration, ethnicity and identity in Roman Britain, is published in the March edition of the journal Antiquity. The “Ivory Bangle Lady” will be the centrepiece of an exhibition at the Yorkshire Museum in August entitled Roman York: Meet the People of the Empire.
Marc, Mike and I have tried to teach you history these many years and you have learned nothing. Like an ignorant child you parrot the findings of Europeans without putting them in the proper context--i.e., interpreting them based on the research of our great scholars.
Your lack of self-esteem allows you to buy into this garbage that interactions between blacks and whites has always been based on a master servant relationship with europeans in the dominant position.
This is only surprising to people who don't know Afrocentric ancient history. J.A. Rogers proved years ago that there were already Blacks in Britain when the Romans came on the scene.
Why do you wait for Europeans to tell you things Black scholars have been teaching for year.It is sad you have failed to learn your own history written by Blacks.
Respect your own researchers then the other man will respect you.
quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: From The Times February 27, 2010
Analysis of Roman grave reveals that York was a multicultural society
Steve Bird Archaeologists have discovered that wealthy black Africans lived in Roman Britain in one of the country’s earliest examples of multiculturalism.
Scientific research techniques have established that a lavish grave containing a woman’s skeleton, an ivory bangle, perfume bottle, mirror and jewellery, belonged to a North African member of York’s high society in the 4th century.
Scientific analysis of isotopes from the teeth revealed that water she drank during her childhood had contained minerals likely to have been found in North Africa. Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race.
Her sarcophagus, which was made of stone, a sign of immense wealth in Roman Britain, was discovered in 1901 in Bootham, York. The city was then a legionary fortress and civilian settlement called Eboracum, founded by the Romans in AD71.
Her well-preserved remains showed that she was 1.5m (5ft 1in) and aged between 18 and 23. There were no signs of a violent death, and muscle markings showed that she had not lived a strenuous life, suggesting that she was affluent. Among the goods found in her grave was a bone with the inscription “Sor ave vivas in Deo” (Hail, sister, may you live in God), suggesting that she may also have been a Christian.
A bracelet of jet, probably from Whitby, North Yorkshire, showed that she had access to local trade networks. Researchers from the University of Reading’s department of archaeology believe that the ivory bangle, an artefact rarely found in Roman Britain, may have been kept by the woman as a memento of home.
Hella Eckardt, who carried out the study, said: “Multicultural Britain is not just a phenomenon of more modern times. Analysis of the ‘Ivory Bangle Lady’ and others like her, contradicts assumptions about the make-up of Roman-British populations as well as the view that African immigrants were of low status, male and likely to have been slaves.”
She said that “Ivory Bangle Lady” was very wealthy — “absolutely from the top end of York society”.
“The link between slavery and Africans is an early modern one. In the Roman world this simply was not the case. Slaves in Roman times could come from any area.”
She added that inscriptions from that period showed that African people were most often members of the imperialist power’s army. But the latest research on a series of skeletons showed that African men had immigrated to Britain, invariably with the Roman Army, and had brought their wives and children.
Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now.
“This skull is particularly interesting, because the stone sarcophagus she was buried in, and the richness of the grave goods, means she was a very wealthy woman.”
The research, A Lady of York; migration, ethnicity and identity in Roman Britain, is published in the March edition of the journal Antiquity. The “Ivory Bangle Lady” will be the centrepiece of an exhibition at the Yorkshire Museum in August entitled Roman York: Meet the People of the Empire.
Marc, Mike and I have tried to teach you history these many years and you have learned nothing. Like an ignorant child you parrot the findings of Europeans without putting them in the proper context--i.e., interpreting them based on the research of our great scholars.
Your lack of self-esteem allows you to buy into this garbage that interactions between blacks and whites has always been based on a master servant relationship with europeans in the dominant position.
This is only surprising to people who don't know Afrocentric ancient history. J.A. Rogers proved years ago that there were already Blacks in Britain when the Romans came on the scene.
Why do you wait for Europeans to tell you things Black scholars have been teaching for year.It is sad you have failed to learn your own history written by Blacks.
Respect your own researchers then the other man will respect you.
.
LOL! Clyde, who said that people here disagree with J.A. Rogers? What they disagree with is YOU and your attempts to tie every black population outside of Africa to Mande speakers! LOL! All you are doing is trying to use the work of REAL scholars as a crutch to support your own nonsense.
Don't get me wrong, linguistics is an important area of research. However it is not enough by itself. There is a difference between disagreeing with some of your theories which are based on little more than often absurd linguistic analysis and disagreeing with all scholarship on African history. The two are not the same. Your position and way of research is yours only, even if other scholars have similar interests.
Posts: 8889 | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Cowering Assoholic: You guys are a bunch of desperate idiots.
"Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race."
Now go hang yourselves desperate illiterate aholes.
LMAO It's obvious who the illiterate one since you missed the supposition word 'or' since craniometry has proven that 'race' is not a concise or objective entity as genetics has proven as well.
Posts: 26238 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Have you guys at least completed undergraduate study? I am starting to think some of you people are not formally educated. What is "OR"?
quote: or [awr; unstressed er] Show IPA –conjunction 1.(used to connect words, phrases, or clauses representing alternatives): books or magazines; to be or not to be.
Do you get it now dimwit? You are the second person who has misread what has been presented in a document today.
"Or" is a conjunction you idiot; its function is to contrast indepedent variables. With that in mind -- The author is reporting that the race of the skull is EITHER black or mixed (the article does not even provide what are the variables to the admixture). The race is inconclusive asshole. All we know is that it is either a black woman or a woman of mixed heritage.
Hopefully one of the more moderate Afro-loons will take you to the corner and whisper in your ear, "You are wrong. Stand down."
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: It's obvious who the illiterate one since you missed the supposition word 'or' since craniometry has proven that 'race' is not a concise or objective entity as genetics has proven as well.
posted
^ Yes, I know what a conjunction is, but as usual you are too dumb to see the point that the whole phrase is a supposition. The woman was either black OR of mixed-black ancestry. It is not clear which, precisely because individuals and especially those of African descent vary a lot in craniofacial physiognomy. Thus your emphasis of her being 'mixed' is null, nor would it make much of a difference since the point of this article is to show the significance of Africans or those of African descent in the Roman Empire. We know how much that destroys your views of blacks in history, but we nor the author of the article really cares. Posts: 26238 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Greece and Rome is what the Euronuts should be defending. They looked to the South with respect and the Northerners as savages.
After all . . .there were many prominent "negros" in Greco-Roman Society
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
Why are you singing to the choir! (LOL) That is what I posted in the thread to you idiots; the lady is not being touted as a "black" woman by the author. Now... explain to me this, idiot:
"You can tell the authors of this article are more in touch with reality when they acknowledge that this woman as a North African was black and not some "caucasian". "
Those are your words, idiot (which btw... prompted me to put you on blast). Where does the author claim this in the article, idiot? (LOL) I swear you guys are so easy!
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: ^ Yes, I know what a conjunction is. But as usual you are to dumb to see the point that the whole phrase is a supposition. The woman was either black OR of 'mixed'. It is not clear which precisely because individuals and especially those of African descent vary a lot in craniofacial physiognomy. Thus your emphasis of her being 'mixed' is null, nor would it make much of a difference since the point of this article is to show the significance of Africans or those of African descent in the Roman Empire. We know how much that destroys your views of blacks in history, but we nor the author of the article really cares.
posted
^ Ignoring the Assoholic angered over the findings of the topic article...
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: Greece and Rome is what the Euronuts should be defending. They looked to the South with respect and the Northerners as savages.
After all . . .there were many prominent "negros" in Greco-Roman Society
Of course. The Greeks and Romans were still ethnocentric and highly chauvinistic but they were not fools the way many euronuts (or their minions) are today. They knew nothing of color or phenotype based prejudice and they've long known of the advanced cultures of black Africans.
By the way, this article reminds me of recent depictions of the Roman Empire such as HBO's Rome where their portrayal of blacks seems to be closer to the truth.
Posts: 26238 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Alcoholic!!! it doesn't matter if the person was mixed or so-called black the point was folks of African descent was part of the make-up of ancient York..Septimus Servus an African of what looked to be of Mixed back-ground himself stationed African troops on the British isle.
Elsewhere in Europe as in "Britain" Black soldiers were actively recruited by Rome and served tours of duty in Britain,France,Switzerland,Poland,Romania,Hungary,Austria..etc.
An original brass military diploma which dates from the middle of the second century A.D mentions Moorish soldiers in Moesia,which is modern Serbia.Another military diploma A.D 158 speakes of Moorish soldiers from Africa in Dacia, or modern Romania,and also of auxiliary troops of the Dacian Moors. A Roman document,Notitia Dignitatum,which dates from the beginning of the fifth century A.D; mentions several Moorish battalions in the Balkans and Moorish military colony Ad Mauros which was located on the Inn river near Vienna; and in what is modern Beseribia,there was a city called Maurocastrum. According to the document Notitia Dignitatum,2500 to 5000 Illyrian Moorish soldiers, in five separate military units,had served in the Near East.From this document we must deduce that at the beginning of the fifth century at least 100,000 descendants of Moors lived in Illyrium, which was located in the Balkans.
Brunson And Rashidi Golden Age Of The Moors:
So I say again that some of the coat of arms may stem from these families
Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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posted
Uh, no sir. It does matter when you have a loon colleague of yours making the following statement and refusing to retract it, even though he was shown to be in err:
"You can tell the authors of this article are more in touch with reality when they acknowledge that this woman as a North African was black and not some "caucasian". "
Are you man enough to tell your colleague that that is an inaccurate statement and that he needs to retract or revise it? I bet you the answer to that is NO. Why? Because people like you are not about honest scholarship. People like you i.e. Afrocentrists, have a racial-political agenda. This is not about academics for you. This is about a struggle, a cause and, by any means necessary, to see it all the way through until you have gained the victory.
Fvck you! I dont have respect for dishonest people.
quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: Alcoholic!!! it doesn't matter if the person was mixed or so-called black the point was folks of African descent was part of the make-up of ancient York.
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: ^ Ignoring the Assoholic angered over the findings of the topic article...
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: Greece and Rome is what the Euronuts should be defending. They looked to the South with respect and the Northerners as savages.
After all . . .there were many prominent "negros" in Greco-Roman Society
Of course. The Greeks and Romans were still ethnocentric and highly chauvinistic but they were not fools the way many euronuts (or their minions) are today. They knew nothing of color or phenotype based prejudice and they've long known of the advanced cultures of black Africans.
By the way, this article reminds me of recent depictions of the Roman Empire such as HBO's Rome where their portrayal of blacks seems to be closer to the truth.
HBO's Rome was the closest dipiction of Egyptians period, except for the Ugly bald white lady Verenus was with...Man that bitch was Ugly as hell. They did a Good job on Cleopatra although she did not Trick Mark Anthony she was gonna kill herself until Octavian stopped her, She resorted to the Apse bite becuase Octavian put her on watch. That Octavian Kid was pretty ugly too he looked like a Demon.
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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quote: But the latest research on a series of skeletons showed that African men had immigrated to Britain, invariably with the Roman Army, and had brought their wives and children. Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now
Now notice this..
Kalonji
Good catch.
Posts: 2007 | From: Washington State | Registered: Oct 2006
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posted
A similar article was written up some yrs back
First Genetic Evidence Of Long-Lived African Presence Within Britain
The researchers, led by Professor Mark Jobling, of the Department of Genetics at the University of Leicester, first spotted the rare Y chromosome type, known as hgA1, in one individual, Mr. X. This happened whilst PhD student Ms. Turi King was sampling a larger group in a study to explore the association between surnames and the Y chromosome, both inherited from father to son. Mr. X, a white Caucasian living in Leicester, was unaware of having any African ancestors.
"As you can imagine, we were pretty amazed to find this result in someone unaware of having any African roots," explains Professor Jobling, a Wellcome Trust Senior Research Fellow. "The Y chromosome is passed down from father to son, so this suggested that Mr. X must have had African ancestry somewhere down the line. Our study suggests that this must have happened some time ago."
Although most of Britain's one million people who define themselves as "Black or Black British" owe their origins to immigration from the Caribbean and Africa from the mid-twentieth century onwards, in reality, there has been a long history of contact with Africa. Africans were first recorded in the north 1800 years ago, as Roman soldiers defending Hadrian's Wall. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/01/070124072328.htm
quote:Are you man enough to tell your colleague that that is an inaccurate statement and that he needs to retract or revise it? I bet you the answer to that is NO. Why? Because people like you are not about honest scholarship. People like you i.e. Afrocentrists, have a racial-political agenda. This is not about academics for you. This is about a struggle, a cause and, by any means necessary, to see it all the way through until you have gained the victory. Fvck you! I dont have respect for dishonest people.
quote:Originally posted by Recovering Afro-holic: You guys are a bunch of desperate idiots.
"Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race."
Now go hang yourselves desperate illiterate aholes.
There is no real way of finding a skull to be "mixed race" you jackass, skulls that are intermediate are not necessarily mixed, except in the rigid typological sense.
Posts: 2595 | From: Vicksburg | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: A similar article was written up some yrs back
First Genetic Evidence Of Long-Lived African Presence Within Britain
The researchers, led by Professor Mark Jobling, of the Department of Genetics at the University of Leicester, first spotted the rare Y chromosome type, known as hgA1, in one individual, Mr. X. This happened whilst PhD student Ms. Turi King was sampling a larger group in a study to explore the association between surnames and the Y chromosome, both inherited from father to son. Mr. X, a white Caucasian living in Leicester, was unaware of having any African ancestors.
"As you can imagine, we were pretty amazed to find this result in someone unaware of having any African roots," explains Professor Jobling, a Wellcome Trust Senior Research Fellow. "The Y chromosome is passed down from father to son, so this suggested that Mr. X must have had African ancestry somewhere down the line. Our study suggests that this must have happened some time ago."
Although most of Britain's one million people who define themselves as "Black or Black British" owe their origins to immigration from the Caribbean and Africa from the mid-twentieth century onwards, in reality, there has been a long history of contact with Africa. Africans were first recorded in the north 1800 years ago, as Roman soldiers defending Hadrian's Wall. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/01/070124072328.htm
quote:Are you man enough to tell your colleague that that is an inaccurate statement and that he needs to retract or revise it? I bet you the answer to that is NO. Why? Because people like you are not about honest scholarship. People like you i.e. Afrocentrists, have a racial-political agenda. This is not about academics for you. This is about a struggle, a cause and, by any means necessary, to see it all the way through until you have gained the victory. Fvck you! I dont have respect for dishonest people.
This is the family. Notice how they tried to make it appear the guys DNA is north Africa instead sub-saharan. The family had Hg A1. For the guy to show his face they labelled the African Y-Dna north African.
Yorkshireman found to share DNA with African tribes Last updated at 22:52em on 27.01.07 Revis has always considered himself a true Yorkshireman who was proud of his ancestry. But he has been forced to confront an entirely different heritage - after scientists uncovered that he has exactly the same DNA imprint as a tribe of African warriors. Scientists last week announced the discovery of the first proof that slaves brought to Britain by the Romans left behind a distinct genetic heritage. This strand was revealed to exist among just seven men with a particular surname hailing from the North of England. However, the academics refused to disclose the identities of any of those men included in the study. Now The Mail on Sunday has discovered that all of those with the African lineage have the surname Revis. Last night, John, 75, a retired surveyor living in Leicester, said: "I started looking into my family history and traced my ancestors back to the mid-1700s. "One line went to the States and became very successful while my immediate line stayed in the North of England and were mostly bakers. There was nothing to suggest that I was African." John responded to a newspaper advert by Leicester University asking for people who have traced their ancestry to give DNA samples for a study on world populations. He said: "The scientists took some of my DNA away for analysis and then one day they called me up and were very excited. They said I had a Y-chromosome that was extremely rare. I was flabbergasted. I had no idea that I was so culturally unique. But I am not going to start eating couscous and riding a camel." John is attempting to take the discovery in his stride. He added: "It was a shock to find out that, because I was so blond and blue-eyed when I was younger, people thought I was Nordic or German. "But the researchers said that if my DNA were examined then people would assume they were looking at a North African man. "I suspect there must have been some big Berber tribesman who came to Britain with the Romans and spread his seed all over Yorkshire." John is married with three children and six grandchildren. The news shocked his friends at Brookfield Bowls Club in Leicester. He added: "It is a very white establishment which can be a little awkward in a multi-racial place such as Leicester. "At least now they can say they have got one more ethnic-minority member but I doubt anyone would be able to pick me out. His wife Marlene was also taken aback." She said: "I can hardly believe it. John has always seemed very English to me. He likes his roast beef and Yorkshire pudding on a Sunday. He has never asked me to cook anything unusual. My friends think our news is hilarious. "The closest John ever came to the traditional Berber life was when he went camping with the Scouts. I don't think we've been in a tent since we got married.' Scientists from Leicester University made the finding during research sponsored by The Wellcome Trust. They were examining the relationship between the male, or Y, chromosome and surnames. Like surnames, the Y-chromosome is passed from father to son, virtually unchanged through generations. Professor Mark Jobling said: "We found John was in the A1 group of Y-chromosomes, which is very rare and highly west African-specific. "This study has shown what it means to be British is complicated and always has been. Human migration history is very complex, particularly for an island nation such as ours. This study further debunks the idea that there are simple and distinct populations or races." Over time, the Y-chromosome accumulates small changes in DNA sequence, allowing scientists to study the relationships between different male lineages. The surname Revis is believed to derive from Rievaulx Abbey in Yorkshire. Berber comes from the Latin word for Barbarian. Fellow researcher Turi King said: "Our findings represent the first genetic evidence of Africans among 'indigenous' British people." She added that Africans were first recorded in northern England 1,800 years ago, brought by the Romans to help defend Hadrian's Wall. Ms King said: "The slave trade was responsible for the influx of Africans in the 16th and 17th Centuries. By the last third of the 18th Century there were 10,000 black people in Britain.
Posts: 87 | From: Sweden | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
Charlie Bass!! my guess is that because the finds are the remains of a wealthy woman of African decent and not a slave..living large in not just Rome but York England burns him to no small ends...if she had been a slave he would gleefully point to how "SUB SAHARAN NEGROES AND A BLACK WOMAN "to boot were looked upon with disfavor from the most ancient of times untill now.
Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: Charlie Bass!! my guess is that because the finds are the remains of a wealthy woman of African decent and not a slave..living large in not just Rome but York England burns him to no small ends...if she had been a slave he would gleefully point to how "SUB SAHARAN NEGROES AND A BLACK WOMAN "to boot were looked upon with disfavor from the most ancient of times untill now.
Indeed, they tried the same thing when "Negroid" affinities were found in a number of graves from Carthage, they tried the slave explanation but it just didn't fly when the grave of the Priestess of Tanit was found to have "Negroid" affinities. Now they trying the mixed race thing.
Posts: 2595 | From: Vicksburg | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
Go feed that red herring to someone else fool. We are talking about the article on the Bangle Lady, you insincere fvck. I knew you could not man-up and tell dude he's off, cause you off too!
posted
Well Avee!!I don't find much of a problem if they found specific North African markers...actually it would make a lot of sense since East-Africa and North-West Africa had a lot more communication with the Roman empire, than countries below the Saharan zone...however they did say this
quote:Professor Mark Jobling said: "We found John was in the A1 group of Y-chromosomes, which is very rare and highly west African-specific.
quote:Go feed that red herring to someone else fool. We are talking about the article on the Bangle Lady, you insincere fvck. I knew you could not man-up and tell dude he's off, cause you off too!
posted
Relax yourself fool. There are a number of articles on it. I assumed you tried to slip an article that had no bearing on the subject. My bad on that. Now, Show me in your article where it says the skull was that of a black woman.
quote:Originally posted by Recovering Afro-holic: Relax yourself fool. There are a number of articles on it. I assumed you tried to slip an article that had no bearing on the subject. My bad on that. Now, Show me in your article where it says the skull was that of a black woman.
This bitch gets Debunked TWICE Damn you fucking stupid...GOOD WORK BRADA for exposing him...LOL
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: Charlie Bass!! my guess is that because the finds are the remains of a wealthy woman of African decent and not a slave..living large in not just Rome but York England burns him to no small ends...if she had been a slave he would gleefully point to how "SUB SAHARAN NEGROES AND A BLACK WOMAN "to boot were looked upon with disfavor from the most ancient of times untill now.
Indeed, they tried the same thing when "Negroid" affinities were found in a number of graves from Carthage, they tried the slave explanation but it just didn't fly when the grave of the Priestess of Tanit was found to have "Negroid" affinities. Now they trying the mixed race thing.
So in other words studies are showing that North Africa was inhabited by a lot more Black Africans..LMAO...I guess us Afrocentrics WIN AGAIN. I wonder what Mathida will do now.???
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
These white people are funny, and so deceptive it's actually disgusting! Notice, the woman is clearly Black African. The University of Reading only classify as North African because of some mild 'European affinities'... ring any bells? The 'mixed-ancestry' bull is just to dilute the blow. How mixed exactly? And 'North African' is just some bogus guess work. Also, note how in the article below they say that if that old man's DNA were tested, they would think they were looking at a North African. Then, because he shares DNA with the Ivory Bangle lady, back apply this logic and start to throw in nonsense about Berber- origins! The woman was African, they are just mixing terminologies to get the 'most-white' result... Racism is truly a degenerative disease...
quote:Originally posted by Avee:
quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: A similar article was written up some yrs back
First Genetic Evidence Of Long-Lived African Presence Within Britain
The researchers, led by Professor Mark Jobling, of the Department of Genetics at the University of Leicester, first spotted the rare Y chromosome type, known as hgA1, in one individual, Mr. X. This happened whilst PhD student Ms. Turi King was sampling a larger group in a study to explore the association between surnames and the Y chromosome, both inherited from father to son. Mr. X, a white Caucasian living in Leicester, was unaware of having any African ancestors.
"As you can imagine, we were pretty amazed to find this result in someone unaware of having any African roots," explains Professor Jobling, a Wellcome Trust Senior Research Fellow. "The Y chromosome is passed down from father to son, so this suggested that Mr. X must have had African ancestry somewhere down the line. Our study suggests that this must have happened some time ago."
Although most of Britain's one million people who define themselves as "Black or Black British" owe their origins to immigration from the Caribbean and Africa from the mid-twentieth century onwards, in reality, there has been a long history of contact with Africa. Africans were first recorded in the north 1800 years ago, as Roman soldiers defending Hadrian's Wall. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/01/070124072328.htm
quote:Are you man enough to tell your colleague that that is an inaccurate statement and that he needs to retract or revise it? I bet you the answer to that is NO. Why? Because people like you are not about honest scholarship. People like you i.e. Afrocentrists, have a racial-political agenda. This is not about academics for you. This is about a struggle, a cause and, by any means necessary, to see it all the way through until you have gained the victory. Fvck you! I dont have respect for dishonest people.
This is the family. Notice how they tried to make it appear the guys DNA is north Africa instead sub-saharan. The family had Hg A1. For the guy to show his face they labelled the African Y-Dna north African.
Yorkshireman found to share DNA with African tribes Last updated at 22:52em on 27.01.07 Revis has always considered himself a true Yorkshireman who was proud of his ancestry. But he has been forced to confront an entirely different heritage - after scientists uncovered that he has exactly the same DNA imprint as a tribe of African warriors. Scientists last week announced the discovery of the first proof that slaves brought to Britain by the Romans left behind a distinct genetic heritage. This strand was revealed to exist among just seven men with a particular surname hailing from the North of England. However, the academics refused to disclose the identities of any of those men included in the study. Now The Mail on Sunday has discovered that all of those with the African lineage have the surname Revis. Last night, John, 75, a retired surveyor living in Leicester, said: "I started looking into my family history and traced my ancestors back to the mid-1700s. "One line went to the States and became very successful while my immediate line stayed in the North of England and were mostly bakers. There was nothing to suggest that I was African." John responded to a newspaper advert by Leicester University asking for people who have traced their ancestry to give DNA samples for a study on world populations. He said: "The scientists took some of my DNA away for analysis and then one day they called me up and were very excited. They said I had a Y-chromosome that was extremely rare. I was flabbergasted. I had no idea that I was so culturally unique. But I am not going to start eating couscous and riding a camel." John is attempting to take the discovery in his stride. He added: "It was a shock to find out that, because I was so blond and blue-eyed when I was younger, people thought I was Nordic or German. "But the researchers said that if my DNA were examined then people would assume they were looking at a North African man. "I suspect there must have been some big Berber tribesman who came to Britain with the Romans and spread his seed all over Yorkshire." John is married with three children and six grandchildren. The news shocked his friends at Brookfield Bowls Club in Leicester. He added: "It is a very white establishment which can be a little awkward in a multi-racial place such as Leicester. "At least now they can say they have got one more ethnic-minority member but I doubt anyone would be able to pick me out. His wife Marlene was also taken aback." She said: "I can hardly believe it. John has always seemed very English to me. He likes his roast beef and Yorkshire pudding on a Sunday. He has never asked me to cook anything unusual. My friends think our news is hilarious. "The closest John ever came to the traditional Berber life was when he went camping with the Scouts. I don't think we've been in a tent since we got married.' Scientists from Leicester University made the finding during research sponsored by The Wellcome Trust. They were examining the relationship between the male, or Y, chromosome and surnames. Like surnames, the Y-chromosome is passed from father to son, virtually unchanged through generations. Professor Mark Jobling said: "We found John was in the A1 group of Y-chromosomes, which is very rare and highly west African-specific. "This study has shown what it means to be British is complicated and always has been. Human migration history is very complex, particularly for an island nation such as ours. This study further debunks the idea that there are simple and distinct populations or races." Over time, the Y-chromosome accumulates small changes in DNA sequence, allowing scientists to study the relationships between different male lineages. The surname Revis is believed to derive from Rievaulx Abbey in Yorkshire. Berber comes from the Latin word for Barbarian. Fellow researcher Turi King said: "Our findings represent the first genetic evidence of Africans among 'indigenous' British people." She added that Africans were first recorded in northern England 1,800 years ago, brought by the Romans to help defend Hadrian's Wall. Ms King said: "The slave trade was responsible for the influx of Africans in the 16th and 17th Centuries. By the last third of the 18th Century there were 10,000 black people in Britain.
posted
I presume you are not referring to the picture. You would not be that foolish. So, you must be referring to the statement in the article:
"Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race."
Brada, you seem like a somewhat intelligent guy. I specifically asked you to show me where in the article it says the lady was black. Your response is that quote. Am I correct?
quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: From the same article; Skull measurements have also established that the “Ivory Bangle Lady” was black or of mixed race.
posted
^ LMAO @ the humiliation and stupidity of Assholelick!
Indeed, you can see his frustration over the fact that this elite lady was of black African descent! Now, if the article said she was a "slave", no doubt the fool not only NOT deny her blackness but emphasize it!
Face the facts Assholelick, blacks were never the inferior beings you wish they were, especially back in ancient times and even in Europe!
This reminds me, where is the Hammered professor?
Posts: 26238 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote: But the latest research on a series of skeletons showed that African men had immigrated to Britain, invariably with the Roman Army, and had brought their wives and children. Dr Eckardt continued: “We’re looking at a population mix which is much closer to contemporary Britain than previous historians had suspected. In the case of York, the Roman population may have had more diverse origins than the city has now
Now notice this..
Kalonji
What study is this diagram from?
Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
It's from one of keita's papers that deal with the Lachish crania. I forgot which one but I print screened and saved it a while back.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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You know it's interesting how they reason that such a finding is nothing more than "left-wing" cultural diversity "propaganda". Yet what are we to make of claims that Egyptian civilization (in Africa) was somehow a mixed "melting pot" of sorts not just blacks? By the way, these fools remind me of Hammered when they interject their silly modern politics instead of fess up to the data. LOLPosts: 26238 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Narmer Menes: These white people are funny, and so deceptive it's actually disgusting! Notice, the woman is clearly Black African. The University of Reading only classify as North African because of some mild 'European affinities'... ring any bells? The 'mixed-ancestry' bull is just to dilute the blow. How mixed exactly? And 'North African' is just some bogus guess work. Also, note how in the article below they say that if that old man's DNA were tested, they would think they were looking at a North African. Then, because he shares DNA with the Ivory Bangle lady, back apply this logic and start to throw in nonsense about Berber- origins! The woman was African, they are just mixing terminologies to get the 'most-white' result... Racism is truly a degenerative disease...
"Deceptive" is not even the word! It must depend on WHO is actually reporting, to get more objective news; 'Even if it's harder for him to swallow, the man has WEST AFRICAN origins, lol.
"By chance, the researchers discovered a white man with a rare Yorkshire surname carrying a Y chromosome haplogroup that had previously been found only in West African men. And even there, it is relatively uncommon.
"We found that he was in haplogroup A1, which is highly West African-specific," said Turi King, a co-author on the study at the University of Leicester.
"The subhaplogroup A1 was first reported in a single individual among a sample of 44 males from Mali.4 Subsequently, this scarce Western African hg has been found in only 25 more males (Figure 1): 2 Moroccan Berbers, 3 African Americans, 2 Mandinka from Gambia/Senegal, 1 Malian Dogon, 1 Cape Verde Islanders, 14 males from Guinea-Bissau, and 2 males from Niger .....This is compatible with a Western African origin for the British chromosome, but does not point to a particular population......The remarkable Y chromosome present in the R surname provides the first genetic evidence of a long-lived African presence within Britain.
posted
Very interesting that Ivory Bangle Lady is no new find. Her stone coffin was unearthed back in 1901.
I find it refreshing that the Ivory Bangle Lady's reconstucted features have been labeled North African. It's a breakthrough that African black facial features are finally being associated with North Africa displacing the "blonde Berber" and the uniformily caucasian stereotype lies.
A computerised reconstruction of how the Ivory Bangle Lady could have looked. Image credit: Dr Hella Eckardt/University of Reading
The complete article that newspapers/blogs reported on is:
S. Leach, H. Eckardt, C. Chenery, G. Müldner, M. Lewis A Lady of York: migration, ethnicity and identity in Roman Britain Antiquity, Volume: 84 Number: 323 Page: 131-145. http://antiquity.ac.uk/ant/084/ant0840131.htm
The authors' affiliations are: Department of Archaeology, School of Human and Environmental Sciences, University of Reading, Reading RG6 6AB, UK
NERC Isotope Geoscience Laboratory, British Geological Survey, Kingsley Dunham Centre, Keyworth, Nottingham NG12 5GG, UK
The quarterly review's blurb on its article reads: Modern methods of analysis applied to cemeteries have often been used in our pages to suggest generalities about mobility and diet. But these same techniques applied to a single individual, together with the grave goods and burial rite, can open a special kind of personal window on the past. Here, the authors of a multidisciplinary project use a combination of scientific techniques to illuminate Roman York, and later Roman history in general, with their image of a glamorous mixed-race woman, in touch with Africa, Christianity, Rome and Yorkshire.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
Some futher reasons why the concept of race is bull-sh!t..
There are other precedents for the finding. The third US president, Thomas Jefferson, probably had a Y chromosome belonging to the haplogroup known as K2. This discovery came out of a project to determine whether he had fathered children from Sally Hemings, a slave owned by Jefferson.
The president had no surname-bearing progeny, so researchers had to test male-line descendents of his paternal uncle.
Jefferson's father claimed Welsh ancestry. But his Y-haplogroup is rare in Europe and has not yet been reported in Britain.
In fact, genetic studies show that Thomas Jefferson's K2 haplogroup ultimately came from north-east Africa or the Middle East, the areas where it is most commonly found today.
posted
The Fulani in Cameroun have K2-M70 at 18%. I think M70 now classifies as marking hg T.
It would be enlightening to test the remains of autochthone British islanders that MacRitchie conclusively found to be native blacks.
Thus we have those CeltIberians the Roman author Tacitus labeled Silures. Were they and other blacks of the pre-Roman British Isles direct remnants of the first R-M173 settlers of Western Europe? Only DNA testing of osteo remains of these peoples will tell.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:The Fulani in Cameroun have K2-M70 at 18%. I think M70 now classifies as marking hg T.
Interesting.. soo... ol slave banging white Thomas Jefferson may have been of Fulani extraction himself wouldn't that be ironic.
Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: Very interesting that Ivory Bangle Lady is no new find. Her stone coffin was unearthed back in 1901.
I find it refreshing that the Ivory Bangle Lady's reconstucted features have been labeled North African. It's a breakthrough that African black facial features are finally being associated with North Africa displacing the "blonde Berber" and the uniformily caucasian stereotype lies.
Exactly what I noted! I mean it's not often you hear scholars, in particular archaeologists admit that blacks were native to North Africa as well. Heck, even the notion is relatively new to many bioanthropologists.
quote: A computerised reconstruction of how the Ivory Bangle Lady could have looked. Image credit: Dr Hella Eckardt/University of Reading
The complete article that newspapers/blogs reported on is:
S. Leach, H. Eckardt, C. Chenery, G. Müldner, M. Lewis A Lady of York: migration, ethnicity and identity in Roman Britain Antiquity, Volume: 84 Number: 323 Page: 131-145. http://antiquity.ac.uk/ant/084/ant0840131.htm
The authors' affiliations are: Department of Archaeology, School of Human and Environmental Sciences, University of Reading, Reading RG6 6AB, UK
NERC Isotope Geoscience Laboratory, British Geological Survey, Kingsley Dunham Centre, Keyworth, Nottingham NG12 5GG, UK
The quarterly review's blurb on its article reads: Modern methods of analysis applied to cemeteries have often been used in our pages to suggest generalities about mobility and diet. But these same techniques applied to a single individual, together with the grave goods and burial rite, can open a special kind of personal window on the past. Here, the authors of a multidisciplinary project use a combination of scientific techniques to illuminate Roman York, and later Roman history in general, with their image of a glamorous mixed-race woman, in touch with Africa, Christianity, Rome and Yorkshire.
Well I emailed the author and she emailed me the whole paper. Is there anyway I can post it or at least link it here??
Posts: 26238 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: Some futher reasons why the concept of race is bull-sh!t..
There are other precedents for the finding. The third US president, Thomas Jefferson, probably had a Y chromosome belonging to the haplogroup known as K2. This discovery came out of a project to determine whether he had fathered children from Sally Hemings, a slave owned by Jefferson.
The president had no surname-bearing progeny, so researchers had to test male-line descendents of his paternal uncle.
Jefferson's father claimed Welsh ancestry. But his Y-haplogroup is rare in Europe and has not yet been reported in Britain.
In fact, genetic studies show that Thomas Jefferson's K2 haplogroup ultimately came from north-east Africa or the Middle East, the areas where it is most commonly found today.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: The Fulani in Cameroun have K2-M70 at 18%. I think M70 now classifies as marking hg T.
Interesting. Another excellent example of questioning the basis of certain lineages being labeled 'Eurasian' in the first place, let alone the whole notion of biological 'races' even existing.
Posts: 26238 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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