posted 08 April 2005 10:03 PM            

Above is a typical definition, as provided by Wikipedia.

posted 08 April 2005 11:42 PM            

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Originally posted by Super car:
The Near East is a term commonly used by archaeologists and historians, less commonly by journalists and commentators, to refer to the region encompassing the Levant (modern Israel, Jordan, Syria and Lebanon), Anatolia (modern Turkey), Mesopotamia (Iraq and eastern Syria), and the Iranian Plateau (Iran). An alternative [b]non-Eurocentric designation in recent years has been 'Southwest Asia', although this term has yet to achieve widespread use. - Wikipedia

Above is a typical definition, as provided by Wikipedia.

Agenda-seeking folks like to hide behind vague terms like the “near East”. Near east to what? It certainly doesn’t imply a continent. Vagueness like this is not accidental; it is applied to make its use as flexible as possible, when the political need in a given situation necessitates it. [/B]

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Thought Writes:

posted 09 April 2005 11:30 AM            

Above is a typical definition, as provided by Wikipedia.

Agenda-seeking folks like to hide behind vague terms like the “near East”. Near east to what? It certainly doesn’t imply a continent. Vagueness like this is not accidental; it is applied to make its use as flexible as possible, when the political need in a given situation necessitates it. [/quote]

This is why serious World History texts, as opposed to ws.t propaganda texts are abandoning such terminologies.....
http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/Forum8/HTML/001791.html

World History Atlas [Dk], sorts as follows...

World History

North America

South America

Africa

Europe

West Asia

South and SouthEast Asia

North and East Asia

Australia and Oceania,

posted 09 April 2005 01:49 PM            

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My dog Crissy could formulate better view points.

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posted 09 April 2005 02:17 PM            

Wow.

Can you possibly put a muzzle on it, and let us talk to Chrissy instead?

posted 09 April 2005 02:36 PM            

east- asia....those areas east of Europe and Med.

Near- the part of the east that is closest to Europe and med.

This is not rocket science and i think we can understand the concept.

Now, more basic information- Africa is not in the near east, but Egypt is, always has been and always will be.

posted 09 April 2005 04:05 PM            

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Originally posted by lamin:
But Horemheb the world is a sphere; it is not an oblong. So if you are in Beijing, where would the Near East be? Or the Far East or the Middle East? Just puzzled!

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He seems to be in a foul mood doesn't he?

Here is something to make him feel better, or maybe not;

The description "Near Eastern" for this branch of archaeology is, of course, highly Eurocentric and Americocentric, reflecting the origins and growth of the field in Western academic tradition. - lockergnome Encyclopedia

Once upon a time there was the Near East, the Middle East, and the Far East. Now there's only a Middle East, and the term is almost exclusively used to describe a very small part of what used to be the Near East. The phrase has probably escaped the general purge of Eurocentric terms like Orient and Far East because it is a convenient way for journalists to refer to Israel and Palestine without going anywhere near the thorny issue of who is entitled to what piece of western Asia. Just the same it seems a strange perversion of the language. Just what East are Israel and Palestine in the middle of, anyway? - Weasel words and Other Perversions of the Language by Peter Donnelly

What needs to be noted here is that not only did eurocentric historians divide the world according to their own needs into the "West" and the "East", "Middle East", "Near-East" and Far-East", the center of the measuring distance being Europe; but they also coined words for other people according to suit their own purpose - Reflections of an American Muslim (Shahid Athar , M. D.)

posted 09 April 2005 04:52 PM            

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Originally posted by lamin:
But Horemheb the world is a sphere; it is not an oblong. So if you are in Beijing, where would the Near East be? Or the Far East or the Middle East? Just puzzled!

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Lamin, these are the obvious questions that arise from serious consideration of terminology like these.

Near East is not a continent, but somehow agenda-seeking folks try to portrait it as such.

Typical references such as those by the likes of Wikipedia, reveal that this is a warped terminology, which can be attributed to none other than agenda-seeking people we've come to know as Eurocentrists.

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Horemheb:
Very elementary geography for challenged people on egyptsearch.

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Let's test this challenge...

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Horemheb:

...east- asia....those areas east of Europe and Med.

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Test #1: East-Asia, right?

Show me a simple map of continental Asia, which suggests the inclusion of mainland Egypt.

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Horemheb:
Near- the part of the east that is closest to Europe and med.

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Making Europe 'the' center, i.e., Eurocentric. Anyway...

Test #2: Considering that Iceland is on the western limit of Europe, and that Russia is regarded as part of Europe, where does the east begin and end, with respect to Europe, that is, if we are going to speak in geographic terms as you just did?

Remember, Africa is right below Europe, and at that, not to its west.

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Horemheb:
This is not rocket science and i think we can understand the concept.

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...which should make it really easy to get straightforward answers from you, right?

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Horemheb:
Now, more basic information- Africa is not in the near east, but Egypt is, always has been and always will be.

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Test #3: How does this square with Egypt being in Africa? If this isn't so, feel free to provide a basic map of continental Africa, which suggests that mainland Egypt isn't part of it.

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Horemheb:

Now, don't bother to make some stupid argument to this. It isn't debatable and there is not another side to the definition.

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posted 09 April 2005 05:48 PM            

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Originally posted by Horemheb:
more crap....you guys can spout this idiotic nonsense to yourselves all day, nobody cares. The text books we teach from will still mention the near east, they will still list the Greeks as founders of western civilization and they will still refer to AE as a polytheistic society. This is like being a fly on the wall of at the insane asylum...it gets wilder every day.

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pseudoscience shows indifference to facts.

Here goes professor with his feel good, ignore basic facts to appeal to his insecure racist dogma. Continue to stick your head in the sand horemheb....we can't tell which end you're talking out of anyway because it all looks, smells and sounds the same...like bull#$*t.....LOL

posted 10 April 2005 09:25 AM            

Well - I couldn't resist...

a bientot
DMc

posted 10 April 2005 11:38 AM            

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Originally posted by Horemheb:
Very elementary geography for challenged people on egyptsearch.

east- asia....those areas east of Europe and Med.

Near- the part of the east that is closest to Europe and med.

This is not rocket science and i think we can understand the concept.

Now, more basic information- Africa is not in the near east, but Egypt is, always has been and always will be.

Now, don't bother to make some stupid argument to this. It isn't debatable and there is not another side to the definition.

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posted 10 April 2005 04:53 PM            

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Originally posted by Pimander:
"Not rocket science" (and not Greece either) ... Carry on , Super Car!
http://www.aiai.ed.ac.uk/~bat/GA/supercar-collectables.html

Well - I couldn't resist...

a bientot
DMc

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??

posted 10 April 2005 06:38 PM            

Is the term "Western Civilization" a euphemism for ‘white culture’ or is it a euphemism for Greek derived culture? If this term is not a euphemism for a hidden ‘racial agenda’ and instead a cultural signifier for the spread of Greek ideas then we have to conceptualize the spread of Greek ideas through the Romans to Northern and Western Europe and through Muslims into Sub-Saharan Africa. Hence it can be argued that the people of Mozambique (Swahili) equally share in “Western Civilization” with the people of Norway (Vikings).

Las reductions orientales en los manuscritos de la Biblioteca Catedral de Toledo
Jose M. Millas Vallicrosa
1942

“In the full fever of the translation of the Greek, those Eastern sciences: astronomy, mathematics, astrology, were syncretized with the Greek, as we can see in the works of al-Jwarizmi. And the Muslims who were in possession of all the elements of the previous cultures worked now on their own, correcting and surpassing the Greeks…”

posted 11 April 2005 12:38 PM            

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Originally posted by Horemheb:
The only one who can make that argument thoughtless is you. Most people have more sense.

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posted 11 April 2005 01:12 PM            

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Originally posted by Horemheb:
After reading what he said its all you need to come up with. He is either using the quote out of context or the spanish historian has been hitting the weed pretty hard.

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posted 11 April 2005 03:22 PM            

Most educated individuals know that the Dark Ages in Europe corresponds with the intellectual zinth of the Muslim world.

The real point however is that contrary to the agenda espoused by Eurocentrists Ancient Greece was genetically, economically, politically and culturally closer to Nubia than contemporary northern Europe.

The ideas of Sumeria and Egypt grew in Greece and spread to northern Europe via the Romans and Sub-Saharan Africa via the Muslims.

posted 11 April 2005 10:40 PM            

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Thought Writes:

Most educated individuals know that the Dark Ages in Europe corresponds with the intellectual zinth of the Muslim world.

The real point however is that contrary to the agenda espoused by Eurocentrists Ancient Greece was genetically, economically, politically and culturally closer to Nubia than contemporary northern Europe.

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That is what the so-called 'dark ages' is really about!

posted 12 April 2005 11:27 AM            

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Originally posted by Horemheb:
There is no such thing as a Eurocentric. Greeks were and are white.

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Thought Writes:

Greeks are and have always been hybrid. Eurocentrism places Europe arbitrarily at the center of the universe. Western Civilization is a euphemism used to facilitate this theory.

posted 12 April 2005 01:22 PM            

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There is no such thing as a Eurocentric. Greeks were and are white.

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Thought replies:

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Greeks are and have always been hybrid. Eurocentrism places Europe arbitrarily at the center of the universe. Western Civilization is a euphemism used to facilitate this theory.

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Horemheb remarks:

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Thoughtless, It doesn't ...it's just a coment about a couple of your usually stupid comments.

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A quick recap…

Horemheb wrote:

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Near- the part of the east that is closest to Europe and med

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Supercar followed up:

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Making Europe 'the' center, i.e., Eurocentric. Anyway…

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Need anymore be said. No answers and least of all, availability of basis, just about sums up your role in the discussions. Any objective person looking at this thread, can see the weak standpoint you continue to display.

posted 12 April 2005 01:46 PM            

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Originally posted by Horemheb:
[B]anyone looking at this site Super car can see the brainless condition of your head. You need to soak in now and then. I'm beiginning ti think you have not had a coherent thought in your life.

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posted 12 April 2005 02:02 PM            

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Originally posted by Horemheb:
I offered to educate you Super Car and the offer still stands. I havent taught secondary school in a long time but I still have the materials. The place to start would be basic world history and geography.

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I know that I am dealing with a very sick fellow here, but anyway, repetition may be the way to go:

...when your medical condition gets better, we can start to look at your needs for basic education. Your reply, as it comes to no surprise, evades the main points at hand, or at times, backs up what is being said, aside from the obvious poor quality of knowledge you exhibit in language. Stop resisting help, and get better; until then, you are dismissed.

This time, you might want to have your nurses read this for you, because your first attempt at reading by yourself, didn't help you address the points made.

posted 12 April 2005 03:02 PM            

SuperCar, Horemheb aka "Hoe-In-Him" has refused to define what **HE** means when he uses the term 'Western Civilization'. The reason that he does so, I suspect, is because he uses the term 'Western Civilization' as a euphimism for 'White Culture'. This is why it is so important for him to make the Greeks (who have greater than 25% African blood/genes)'white'. If he were really using the term 'Western Civilization' to mean cultures influenced by ancient Greece he would recognize that most of Africa, Europe, Asia and the New World at this point have been influenced by Greece. The Romans spread this knowledge to western and northern Europe and the Muslims spread it to Sub-Saharan Africa.

posted 12 April 2005 11:13 PM            

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Originally posted by Thought2:
Thought Writes:

If he were really using the term 'Western Civilization' to mean cultures influenced by ancient Greece he would recognize that most of Africa, Europe, Asia and the New World at this point have been influenced by Greece. The Romans spread this knowledge to western and northern Europe and the Muslims spread it to Sub-Saharan Africa.

[This message has been edited by Thought2 (edited 12 April 2005).]

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Thought Writes:

The Mediterranean region was essentially a melting pot, drawing in people from Africa, Asia and Europe. The populations and societies closest to this cross-road benefited from the economic and social exchange their geography facilitated. The Mediterranean eventually served as a vacuum sucking in the resources of Inner Asia, Inner Africa and Inner Europe. Ancient Egypt began as a Saharan-Sudanese civilization, centered around dessicating bodies of water just like Kerma, Punt (Mahal Taglinos), Dhar Tichitt, Aksum, Germa, the Sao, Ghana, Mali, and Songhai. Overtime the focus of AE shifted to the Mediterranean. Greece and is rooted in a neolithic diffusion process from SW Asia to the Balkins. The earliest Greeks were hybrid based upon the fact that a portion of the language (Bernal), skeletal remains (Angel) and genes (Semino et al.) can be traced back to the early Holocene in East Africa.